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Wednesday, July 06, 2005

Natalee Holloway Discussion 35

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Update: All of the Natalee Holloway posts are archived in one category - available at sidebar see NH under "categories," or click here. Scroll to bottom and read up to follow the timeline - latest reports at top.

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The family of Natalee Holloway is now offering $150.000.00 for the Safe Return or information that will lead to the safe return of Natalee. A Reward and Recovery Trusts have been set up through Amsouth Bank in Birmingham, AL.

A trust fund has been set up to support Natalee Holloway's mother, Beth Twitty, who has pledged to stay in Aruba until her daughter is found. Contributions may be made at any AmSouth Bank, or by mail to:

Natalee Holloway Trust

AmSouth Bank

P.O. Box 11426 Birmingham, AL 35202

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Just signing on to call it a night and let IHOP and the rest keep up the good work. 'Nite, Y'all.

G'nite tideroller

During the past couple of days I've come to the conclusion that my efforts here have been nothing but a huge waste of time on my part. Nothing is going to change the facts that Natalee is dead and her body will never be found and no one will ever be convicted of her murder.

The corrupt government is never going to admit that Natalee was murdered because the only thing they see are dollar signs. And admitting she was murdered would hurt the flow of those dollars. Nothing is going to change, it'll be business as usual.

Maybe I'm pessimistic. Maybe I've fought too many battles without seeing any positive effect. I don't know. All I know is that it's time to move on

What has happened to FG?

Moonshadow & Prof--

There seems to be a plethora of agreements between the US and Netherlands and Aruba concerning their banking. This is just one:

>>>Aruba, which has autonomous control over its internal affairs, is a part of the Kingdom of the Netherlands, and through the Netherlands, Aruba participates in the Financial Action Task Force (FATF) and therefore participates in the FATF mutual evaluation program. The GOA has a local FATF Committee that oversees the implementation of the FATF recommendations. As part of its commitment to combat the financing of terrorism, another committee has been formed to ensure cooperation within the Kingdom of the Netherlands. Aruba is a member of CFATF and served as its Chairman in 2001.

In 1999, the Netherlands extended application of the 1988 UN Drug Convention to Aruba. The Netherlands’s Mutual Legal Assistance Treaty with the United States applies to Aruba, though it is not applicable to requests for assistance relating to fiscal offenses addressed to Aruba>Confiscation

7. Confiscation measures should provide for the authority to seize, freeze, and confiscate, at the request of a foreign state, property in the jurisdiction in which such property is located regardless of whether the owner of the property or any persons who committed the offence making the property subject to confiscation are present or have ever been present within the jurisdiction.

8. Countries should provide for the possibility of confiscating any property that represents assets that have been directly or indirectly derived from drug offences or related money laundering offences (property confiscation), and may also provide for a system of pecuniary sanctions based on an assessment of the value of assets that have been directly or indirectly derived from such offences. In the latter case, the pecuniary sanctions concerned might be recoverable from any asset of the convicted person that may be available (value confiscation).

9. Confiscation measures may provide that all or part of any property confiscated be transferred directly for use by competent authorities, or be sold and the proceeds of such sales deposited into a fund dedicated to the use by competent authorities in anti-narcotics and anti-money laundering efforts.

10. Confiscation measures should also apply to narcotic drugs and psychotropic substances, precursor and essential chemicals, equipment and materials used or destined for the illicit manufacture, preparation, distribution and use of narcotic drugs and psychotropic substances.<<

So the US does have leverage in this regard. Just the hassle of accounting for all the money and filing forms and reports could be considered a form of pressure. I know it is when I have to do this and why my taxes are right now under an extension.

I think this is a viable avenue for checking because it is legal and under an accord and could explain why there is such resistence to give an accounting of our missing citizen.

PHANTOM,

HAVING YOU HERE IS WORTH IT.

I HOPE YOU STAY WITH ALL OF US

Dont give up. That is giving in to the pressure and exactly what they want.

BULLSHARK

unfortunately it got really ugly when you were gone.

she was a bit frustrated.

especially b/c ppl were really plowing on IHOP.

it made a lot of us really mad b/c of how much she has done here.

if you catch up with her, please tell her i said hello.

by the way i just read about bullsharks in people magazine. they stay closest to the shore and they have the most testosterone.

She was in for a few minutes yesteday but that is all I have seen of her in a week.

I have a bullseye on my handle! :=0

Phantom, that is what "they" want, for us to give up. It's easy, I tell you for them when they see us giving up.

Send letters, send E-mails, and see how things can be changed. Even if Natalee is never found, pressure must be applied, so this does not become a trend, but stand up so they know we will be willing to do what it takes to take their privilege to kill-and-get-by-with-it away from them.

We will no longer accept sweeping crime stats aside. Let them know they must, must be held accountable and even if we do not succeed in Natalee's return to her home, we will succeed at making that little island of malaise more accountable and perhaps poorer, thereby paying the proverbial piper.

Yes, Anna, there is plenty of leverage to be had.

PHANTOM

we all feel as you do, please know that you are NOT alone!!!

and i don't think you are being pessimistic. anyone who has held up hope for this long is not a pessimist.

you are being practical.

i just try to remember those who know or knew natalee may be coming here for answers and try not to "go there" out loud!!

then again a miracle may fool us all like douglas wood in iraq or elizabeth smart

I have a bullseye on my handle! :=0

Posted by: Island Hopper | July 7, 2005 12:04 AM

IHOP

you are way better at it than I!!

I read what Fla Girl said and she was mad yesterday I think she was mad about the same thing i was!!

Send emails to American Society of Travel Agents at askasta@astahq.com
Ask all you friends and neighbors to do the same.
asking them to add this to all travel brochures for Aruba.

The following story appeared in the Dutch (regional) press about Aruba. The Netherlands Daily, Nederlands Dagblad, placed it in their front page.

Arubans know this: every month thousands of American juniors bcome to the island for sex, drugs and booze. On Aruba you are allowed, contrary to the situation at home in America , drink when you are sixteen and for (smoking) a joint you will not end up in jail. ”Here they do everything what they are not allowed to do at home and surely can’t do at home”, Gijs van 't Hullenaar says. As a manager he owns several bar and nightclubs.

Phantom,
Yes, but we do not have to like it one bit. The fix was in from the get-go with the refusal to collect the forensic evidence and now we are told there is no evidence. Well, DUH!! Yet when anyone suggested that said evidence be collected we were told we were not respecting their culture and legal system.

Just how stupid do the people perpetrating this cover up think we are! Of course there is no evidence when the prime suspects were given ten days to destory it.

So not only is your assessment likely correct, the victim and her family are being trashed and threats of arrest and calling the father a suspect and the ones who most likely did this threatening to sue the victim's family.

As that old joker used to say "WHAT A COUNTRY!" No wonder they are so happy being a protectorate of one of the largest producers in the entire world of Ecstacy. We have certainly seen a side never presented in the travel brochures for sure.

It was not the crime but the cover up that frosts me. The insults and the refusal to collect evidence and now we must forever listen to the fact there is no evidence as though none existed instead of they refused to take it because it was on the LE chief's best friend's son and this is not a place that wants any deep digging to happen.

Phantom

I have read a lot of your posts. Your efforts are greatly appreciated.

Hope to see you back again. :O)

Thanks Hopper and Elaine

So FG is pretty much outta' here? Bummer. I will drop her an e-mail. I am quite sure you can take care of yourself, Hopper. :)

Elaine, is that a new issue you read? If so, I'll have to pick one up.

IHOP

1. if you want the Florida attorney general's home address i have it. He lives in the house my grandfather built and my mom grew up in and he went to high school with my mom.

2. when Dan starts doing stuff on Iraq again, I get daily transcriptions from jihadi message boards, usually stuff (serious stuff) before reported or before it occurs in the news.

Let me know if you ever want to see this stuff.

Island Hopper - The Judge (see paste below)

Aruba Today
Tuesday, July 5. 2005

ORANJESTAD(AP) – On Monday,
Judge Smit of Curacao released
two Surinamese brothers held for
nearly a month in connection with
the disappearance of a U.S. teen. A
third detainee, the 17-year-old son
of a justice official in Aruba, was
ordered held for 60 more days.

They keep accusing our media of bashing their island! Let's show them that it is their only sweet Netherlands helping them out along with the stupid local Arubans they choose to quote.


Send emails to American Society of Travel Agents at askasta@astahq.com

Ask all you friends and neighbors to do the same.
asking them to add this to all travel brochures for Aruba ESPECIALLY FOR HIGH SCHOOL GROUPS.


The following story appeared in the Dutch (regional) press about Aruba. The Netherlands Daily, Nederlands Dagblad, placed it in their FRONT page.


Arubans know this: every month thousands of American juniors bcome to the island for sex, drugs and booze. On Aruba you are allowed, contrary to the situation at home in America , drink when you are sixteen and for (smoking) a joint you will not end up in jail. ”Here they do everything what they are not allowed to do at home and surely can’t do at home”, Gijs van 't Hullenaar says. As a manager he owns several bar and nightclubs.

Someone had posted the question in an earlier post as to whether sharks eat clothing... and they do sometimes swallow clothing... this was in reference to the theory that Nataleee... if deceased... that her body has been disposed of on the side of Aruba where there are sharks,,,I read somewhere that they even feed these sharks to try to keep them over on that side,, http://www.oberlin.k12.oh.us/talent/isp/reports2002/5rachel.htm ,,,,,,,,, Sharks do swallow clothing... Sharks use their snout to hunt down food. If there is someone or something bleeding in the water, sharks will be attracted to the scent. They can smell it even from one half-mile distance. This can cause a feeding frenzy. A feeding frenzy is when sharks come from all directions and start to eat. Sharks do not chew their food, they swallow it whole. Sharks often eat things that are floating in the water, such as, an old boot, clothing, or even cardboard.

FYI does this Judge have a first name? It is kind of hard to research without it. Thanks.

bullshark

it was the issue from last week w/ jolie and pitt (whoop dee doo!!) on the cover. story about first 2 shark attacks.

being on this blog i am finally reading it. not a huge story on the sharks, just a brief description of them, but I thought of you : )

sad for the victims though!

Island Hopper -

The article din't reference a first name. Maybe that slip up by Julia Renfroe was referring to this judge. Didn't she say George? So, maybe George Smit?????

bullshark

if you email FG tell her to come during the night again. it is nice people then

the 411 on earlier today, sorry i did not answer you then. i had to step away. the person was insistant last week that i was a he and that i was signing on as all different ppl and emailed Dan and asked to ban me.

el bizzaro!!!!!!!!!

I think when any of us get too close to something a mystery poster appears and targets that poster for attack. I Hop must just be doing a good job but the rest of us get hit once in a while as well.

Maybe I am paranoid but just seems odd, that. Hope I Hop will never give up and all of us since we are not likely to even get back a body for the mother, once she gives the word, be ready to do whatever she wants.

Once Beth totally gives up on their ever doing the right thing, we can only do very little but what little we can do will remind them that we know what they did and how this was covered up. They can insult us all they want but they will know for many years to come that we know their guilt and will punish when and where we can no matter how small and insignificant it may seem to them.

Aruba has lost a lot of good friends by doing this and I hope those three punks are worth it to them and that the influence JVDS has from his specialty at making evidence disappear for people like Ben King, well the price tag for that has come due and I have to wonder if he and his son are worth it to the rest of the Island.

IHOP

JUST GOOGLED JUDGE SMIT ARUBA

several hits for B. Smit

BT has made the Cover Welcome page of aol.

He is from Curacoa

Merlin:

No offense intended, but a C&P from a 12 year-old's science fair project is hardly worth posting. With the exception of a couple of breeds, sharks do NOT tend to have a taste for human flesh as it is leaner than they prefer.

Yes, they would scavenge on remains, but no more so than other scavengers such as crabs. It is unlikely that they would eat clothing, although large breeds such as Whites and Hammerheads have been known to eat shoes, bouys, and even license plates (no kidding).

The feeding-to-sharks theory is, IMO, very unlikely. Although anything is possible, weighing down a body and dumping it into the sea is much more likely than deliberately feeding "frenzied" sharks.

As promised, here is a second letter to your senators and congressmen, focusing upon anti-money laundering treaties:

Dear Senator,

Undoubtedly, you are aware of the disturbing details surrounding the disappearance of Natalee Holloway in Aruba on May 30 of this year. Not only does it appear that a violent crime has been committed against an American citizen, but there are troubling indications of corruption and a cover-up in the investigation of that crime.

The United States has a Mutual Legal Assistance Treaty (MLAT) with the Netherlands, as well as the 1989 treaty establishing the Financial Action Task Force on Money Laundering (FATF), to which both the United States and the European Commission are signatories. Note that both treaties provide for the sharing of banking information involving money laundering and other criminal activities.

Aruba is a known center for the transhipment of drugs and of money laundering. And complex and incestuous relationships on the island of Aruba may be contributing to the corruption and secrecy surrounding the investigation of the disappearance of Natalee Holloway. A crime has been committed; money may have changed hands; and you have the treaty authority to demand some answers.

Please use every provision of these two treaties to put pressure on the Kingdom of the Netherlands and the island of Aruba to be open and transparent in its investigation of the disappearance of Natalee Holloway; and if this crime goes unsolved, to press for a thorough and transparent cold-case review into the investigation.

Respectfully.

About the judges.

The very first judge to hear any of the
case was excused because of the Dad of
Joran. Then there was another judge that
heard to case I think that was also
local. Then they flew a judge in from
another island to hear the case the
2nd time around.
Then there was the judge that missed
his flight. (Not sure who he was suposed
to be) but the next day another judge
was flown in to hear the case and it was
a different one than who was suposed to
come that missed his flight.
I do not know who the judge is that
let the boys loose. Do not know if he
was flown in or not.
There will be a panel of 3 judges to hear
the appeals coming up.
Correct me if I am wrong about this.
Would like to better understand it myself.

Way to go BHT

Now fo the TiIME Woman of the Year Award!!!!!!!!!!!

ANNA

well i did not know wtf that NYNY was trying to say to you today. I was going to say something to him/her if they did not simmer down too!!

All

perhaps for judges they shroud them in secrecy the same way that they do for those accused of a crime

now that i think about it, in Holland they have "mystery" names for the accused. Like the Morrocan nutcase who killed Theo Van Goegh for speaking up for the rights of islamic woman to not undergo female genital mutilation (among other things).

they gave this freak anonymity by calling him
mohamed b. but my dutch friends tell me, no big deal, they just read the american news and find out their real names : )

IHOP

don't they do that alot? the last judge or prosecutor also lived on the island of curacao, i believe it is a 20 minute plane ride?

maybe they have to do that b/c that is the only way to "protect" them from the "evils" of the average aruban law abiding citizen!!

Welcome Back, Shark :)

"As promised, here is a second letter to your senators and congressmen, focusing upon anti-money laundering treaties:"

Professor what do you mean "your senators and congressman"

there is nothing to be found under smit or schmidt

there is no official listing of the judges in the dutch kingdom at all.

Thanks MS. Good to be back and I see you are still on top of your game. :)

It's a good letter, professor. (I would not have let them off so easy)

lol I found it interesting....

!

that judge lived on the island of curacao

also steve croes is from there too. i think that is a pretty common reciprocal route.

I ahve to agree, She is a strong women, reminds me of my mom, she would beat the **** out of anyone that dissed one of her daughters, or even hurt, point in question, one of the boyfriends got the friendly end of her fist one day.

I'm just getting warmed up, shark ;)

They almost have me in "lobbying mode"

(please don't make me go there...)

Is it better to "hand pick" from Curaco than having to do a long-range guess on who from the Netherlands might be the least objective as it pertains to this case.

I suspect money changes hands all the time with these judges and no judge is going to adjudicate this case as it should be. JMHO.

Before long, I expect we are going to hear them saying "it's just about sex." Ooops. I best be careful before I am foist on my own pitard.


Once Beth totally gives up on their ever doing the right thing......
Posted by: Anna | July 7, 2005 12:18 AM

Beth is only human, and can only endure so much.
She has more guts than most people I know. In my
heart, I don't think that Beth will ever give up
her search. She has all of our support and a VERY
large circle of friends as well.

Beth has been diappointed by the (in)justice system
in Aruba, but each setback seems to strengthen
her resolve all the more.

She will have her day.

IMHO,

bamaboy

Well, they never had this in there backyard before. did they?

What do you mean "evils" mrsjimi? I don't think they have deer on Aruba. So what are the hunters going to do on weekends. I guy running down the road in a judges robe and powdered wig makes an awesome target. That is called common sense not "evils"

Merlin:

Like I said, no offense intended. :)

Goodnight people. Long couple of days travelling and I need some sleep.

Hey has anyone checked to see if there are any live webcams set up in the areas that Natalie was supposedly dropped off at or left. Maybe one might have caught something?

IAMCANADIAN

where have you been

this is your fellow cane.

just changed my name here

G'nite Bullshark

GEE CHEE

I was being sarcastic about the aruban people.

just showing how the "other half" lives there and justifies it.

excuse the pun but hopping from one island to the other while they hold other people's lives in their hands like it means nothing at all

Hey hendrix,
I am deep in the north, where you?
any updates on thecase?

IHop, check Hawaii, see if you can find a list of all judges in Hawaii?

UGA sucks! :)

Jug chickened out - if he has something on anybody, speak up or shut up - do not criticize a judge, may his/her name be Wit, Smit or Babaloo

Posted by: blacklable | July 7, 2005 12:37 AM

BLACKLABLE

please explain this.

why are so many people picking on jug twitty?

Jug has not chickend out. I expect the information is being wired to the "right" people. Beth just had a lapse of judgment when she "almost" spilled her guts, but I cannot say that I would not have already done so. I think she has been phenomenal and I salute her and would love her on the cover of Time for WOMAN OF THE YEAR.

Be careful, Jug may be transmitting messages that include "blacklabel" somewhere. Be very, very careful. This board is watched very, very carefully by people from all places.

Several people have raised the point about how Paulus could have said, "No body, no crime." There were some who wanted to argue that he said "corpse" not body, because that was the quote from the prosecutor.

Consider this.. my guess is that Paulus spoke in Dutch, not in English, and used the word "lijk" which would be translated as body or corpse.

But, the real question is "what is the context in which he said it?".

There could have been a simple dialog like this:

Joran: Dad, people are spreading rumors around that Natalee was murdered. Lots of the Americans are accusing me and the Kalpoe brothers. I'm sure she is ok, and will turn up soon, because when I left her she was fine.

Paulus: Well, don't worry about people spreading vicious rumors. Missing persons are just that and hopefully she will be found in good health somewhere.

Joran: But, they are saying on CNN everyday that she was murdered.

Paulus: I don't know how they could say such a thing. If there has been no body found yet on any missing persons case, there is no crime.


So, you see how a very normal conversation between Joran and his Dad with the Kalpoes present could have been totally casual and non-incriminating. But, when the prosecutor tells it, it is reduced to "No corpse, no crime."

Directed at Geech, MS. Sorry Geech; I just couldn't help myself.

Goodnight.

this is interesting...... read page 4

http://64.233.187.104/search?q=cache:3dH-
f_u75fMJ:www.newr.bham.ac.uk/pdfs/Trafficking/Net
herlands1.pdf+Judge+smit+dutch&hl=en&lr=lang_en

you have to copy and past it so I don't blow the margin again.

Bullshark

stay on topic

Moonshadow

University of Georgia i believe

This got lost in the shuffle of ethnicity or race:

How can the 2 black securuty gaurds stil be considered suspects or person of interests when they know nothing of the case.


However


The 2 Kalpoe Brothers are free to leave Aruba without any restrictions.


What kind of fly by law does Aruba have?

Is this how the Netherlands support Aruba LE or the Prosecution?

mrsjimi if the judge's name is babaloo, I'm going to have to rethink this whole thing.

Well,
if it is watched, maybe there will be some action? Be jason bourne!

bamaboy

I agree, I do not know how she holds herself
together. Its so sad that they boys will not
just tell the real truth. But, i think we
all know why they want.

gee chee I dont have time for that nonsense

geechee: do you walk upright

Abu Musab Rajir

are you converting to our religion?

stranger things have happened!!

maybe you are just spying tonight : )

IAMCANADIAN

i am out in cali.

let me guess, you are in canada? LOL

well we both lived in Coral Gables once upon a time!! hehehe

Anyone know anything more on all the
judges involved so far.?

Also do you think the lady that is
prosecuting these cases is for real
or just going through the motions ?

I guess anyone can be bought.

Hope this is not the case with her, too.

Thats all Beth needs.


I had that before , many moons ago, that same phrase, can't remember your handle, but thanks for responding.

WARNING...I'm lurking!! Houseguest just went to bed....what do I do? Hit the computer!!

Hopper---Thank you!!

OMG witchy,LOL, I just read your post from a few back, I knew you were being sarcastic silly, what do you think my answer was, LMAO. I thought at least you, could pick out the goofs from the serious. The serious ones are me the others are me typing john stewarts answers, lol

hola' chica

this is the peaceful time

welcome to happy hour

Fox News reported that the Kalpoes are considering sueing Beth Twitty, if she continues to call them criminals.

If what I've read on this forum tonight is true -- that Joran is appealing the Judge's decision to keep him in jail and that the brothers are threatening to sue Natalee Holloway's family -- we need to brace ourselves for a serious battle. These people are seemingly positioning themselves to fight fire with fire -- no matter what their reasons/agenda. As a start: whoever suggested writing to the State Department, local Senators or Congressmen, travel agent associations, airlines, and other legitimate means for requesting assistance in this situation is right on target (in my humble opinion). It's a start.

Well after watching the Greta on Fox tonight, it seems clear that the mother of NH based her initial kidnapping theory on nothing more than her imagination or gut feeling. The mother appeared to have lost it and started shooting from the hip based simply on the fact that her daughter could not be accounted for. She starts driving at speeds of 120 mph and calling 911 to report her daughter kidnapped. That goes a long way toward understanding the mindset of the Bama crowd when the pulled up to the PVDS home at 3 am.
Don't know if it would have changed anything at all if the tactics of the Bama group had been different, maybe not, but one never knows about things like that.

Well, I really am off to bed now, but Roger is up to his same-o, same-o, hypothesizing without any back-up, just throwing out his wild, hare-brained, unsubstantiated, what-if "scenarios". Roger there are witnesses to what PVDS said. There are no witnesses to your made-up scenario. But now, I do have a scenario for you that is based on the evidence and testimony that we have so far. Joran drugged her (witnesses give a perfect description of her having been 'carved out' by Joran). The Kaopoe's drove him and Natalee back to Joran's place (Logical place.). How many participated in the rape? (Joran has admitted to sex). I don't know, my guess is all three. Something happened to Natalie (probably a reaction between the alcohol and the drugs and she died. The boys said "Something bad happened.") Papa helped get rid of the body. (There's plenty of evidence that he likes to destroy evidence.) And there you have it. What part do you not understand? You know, it's really not nice to sow seeds of discontent. It doesn't become you. Again, I ask how much are they paying you? Mite-nite for real this time. Exam tomorrow.

meant ,Msjimihendrix

It's difficult to tell if the prosecutor is serious about this case, or not. There are times when I think she talks out of both sides of her mouth.

I have a hard time reading people like that. I have known quite a few and read quite a few. Until you an sit down and talk with them, as I am sure Beth has, it is hard to say.

your welcome what did ya think? yea or nay

MrsJimi-
I just had my own happy hour!! One cocktail and I'm struggling with typing!! Plus, I can't catch up!! Damn, you people can talk!

Jug Twitty adores his lovely wife and
I commend him on standing by her side
as he has. He is her strength to carry
on. A good man!!

Hey

Is it safe to enter???

Did you read my post earlier MrsJimmy??

Bye the way, did you see the movie The Next Ten Yards with Bruce Willis?
Every time I see you post MrsJimmy in my head I pronounce it like the little guy with glasses in the movie "Yimmy" lol

So MrsYimmy how are you?

Come on now bullshark..u dont mean that

You can smell the rot from here....do these people think we fell off of the turnip truck or what?

There is no way no way possible to explain all of the descrepencies in this investigation. This is a group of people protecting one of their own.

It seems as though they are pushing Beth and Jugs buttons praying that they will reveal some of what they have discovered so they can call a mistrial.

I pray for the Twitty's to stay strong and remember loose lips sink ships. Keep your resolve for the sake of Natalee the truth will come out they can not get away with this...the world is watching!!!!

If these people think for one second that they are fooling anyone they are crazy or they are all on crack...that could be it drugs are legal...they are all stoned out of their minds if they think they can conivnce us that they don't know what happened and have tried to clean up this mess they really are a bunch of idiots....we are watching and we know you are hiding the truth the writing is on the wall.

Roger,

I get it sorta, kinda, in away, maybe perhaps.

NOT

Paulus: I don't know how they could say such a thing. If there has been no body found yet on any missing persons case, there is no crime.


So, you see how a very normal conversation between Joran and his Dad with the Kalpoes present could have been totally casual and non-incriminating. But, when the prosecutor tells it, it is reduced to "No corpse, no crime."

Posted by: roger | July 7, 2005 12:41 AM

If my son said he was accused of murdering someone, I wouldnt say that above.

but

Not to worry son you are innocent you didnt murder anyone. Did you?

Why would an innocent person need to know "no body no case."


Only someone would cite no body no case, without
1knowing the victim was dead
2 knowing the body is well hidden
3 knowing the law.
4 reassuring a guilty party

Roger, you still here?

UGA? go Dawgs

Canadian Girl

THANK YOU!!

i cannot access that thread anymore. So i could not respond and then I was not sure if you were still there.

I don't know ppl can just be cruel i guess.

Hopper-
Very little surprises me (especially in relation to this aggressive boy-man Joran). Scary. I give it a "yea"!

If what I've read on this forum tonight is true -- that Joran is appealing the Judge's decision to keep him in jail and that the brothers are threatening to sue Natalee Holloway's family -- we need to brace ourselves for a serious battle. These people are seemingly positioning themselves to fight fire with fire -- no matter what their reasons/agenda. As a start: whoever suggested writing to the State Department, local Senators or Congressmen, travel agent associations, airlines, and other legitimate means for requesting assistance in this situation is right on target (in my humble opinion). It's a start.

What could Jug possibly know that is "explosive and will shock the world"....I just can not figure out what it could be that the media or anybody here has not tossed out.Does he know that they know that she may be dead.Maybe Joran did confess and somebody told her that but then was told by the higher ups to back off.Any thories?

Actually, I believe that the Kalpoes are concerned about their impeccable character being tarnished by all these kidnapping rumors.

Dar, I agree.
People will do anything for money.
I am beginning to believe that the
#1 funding of the Island is drugs
and tourism is some where else down
the line.

The Dutch news presenter, Greta Van Susteren, isn't seen in Aruba, however, she is quoted from time to time and mentioned frequently on this blog.

Nice to know that the Dutch are represented there in the American media.

Funny thing about tideroller's post. When I posted my "Profile of the Narcissist," somebody mentioned that sex on the beach doesn't fit that type of personality. Clean sheets are needed. And then later, I heard that his mama took him clean sheets, even in prison. Punk.

Harry, they have every right sue her. You just can't keep saying that if you can not prove it but, I think they just want her to stop saying it. If she repeats it at this point she's kinda getting bad advice, cause that was like a public warning. We'll have to wait and see if it worked and she tones it down.

Did anyone else see Beth on Greta tonight, going through her first 24 hours upon learning that her daughter had missed her flight? I thought it was very interesting, and Beth kept saying, 'kidnapped' and there has to be some significance to that, don't you think?

Mrs Jimi...you crack me up! Keep 'em coming, you little wing, you.

Mahalo-

What could Jug possibly know that is "explosive and will shock the world"....

Where did you hear that?

MRS Hendrix Please use the bug spray.


On the prosecutor...... No, I think she is part of the game. She is the one that said "we can't just go in like cowboys".
But then also said that it is not up to the prosecutor to collect evidence it is the polis and they are totally seperate. Is it illegal for her to say the Polis are NOT doing their job?

Now she is threatening to rearrest the security guards for telling Greta that PVDS was in on the lie? RIDICULOUS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

The Twitty's need an impartial prosecutor and judge but with all the inbreeding in the Dutchies how the heck are you EVER going to find one?

Roger, I thought they arrested you with that little girl at Denny's

Tourism is just a cover, drugs and money laundering is main income

"Now she is threatening to rearrest the security guards for telling Greta that PVDS was in on the lie? RIDICULOUS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!"


HELP...we're back to square one?! What happened?!!

Hey Roger: Some nit wits contiune to cite the PVDS comment about no body no crime without including the fact that this comment was taken from the bugging of the PVDS pool area by the cops days after the boys were first interviewed by the police and not arrested. I fail to see how some can draw a conclusion from that product of a secret bugging that PVDS had anything to do with what happened to the physical body of NH.

If the Kalpoe brothers sue, then BTH has the right to defend themselves with the accumulated evidence they have to call the brothers "criminals."

The Kalpoe brothers would have to offer differing evidence where they arent to be labeled
"criminals."

The Kalpoe Brothers are just posturing, they dont want to go down that slippery slope.

The Pandora's Box would really be opened and all the dots would be followed.

PROFESSOR

LOL

RAJIR

what happened to the Amerikan media?????

professor: LMAO

MrsJimi-
You should really invest in a spell check!! LOL!

IHOP, you know this is the weirdest prosecutorial ploy if there is such a thing here that I have ever heard of, but when I heard she was 'threatening' to re-arrest Jones & Johns for what they told Greta, it made me wonder if she was hoping there was more information to be gleaned from them that they did not need to be telling, lest it sacrifice confidential information. Just a thought, but you are probably right.

I think everyone in that desert/beach has been swimming in the same end of the gene pool and probably have no idea since they appear to be a group of incestuous drug addicts, so it makes them forget who they fornicated last night.

Well said Island Hopper.

Wish there was someway they could
get some unbias people to handle this.
That would help, but do not know if
that is allowed by their laws & the
clowns that are in position to do
anything like that.
Sounds like the 'whole' goverment in
place are corrupt.

Professor

LOL I spit water everywhere when I read that one!!!

Ten Points:0)

Roger, I thought they arrested you with that little girl at Denny's

Posted by: professor | July 7, 2005 01:03 AM

PROFESSOR

OMG!!

We need to bring Gilligan and Marianne in on this!!

You cannot argue with a Kafir!!

Professor, your wit is rapier sharp tonight.

"But then also said that it is not up to the prosecutor to collect evidence it is the polis and they are totally seperate. Is it illegal for her to say the Polis are NOT doing their job?"

IHop if you are going to twist someones words, don't you think it would be better not to type them out so that we don't actually see you doing the twisting in front of us?

LAW 77

WHAT IS YOUR PROBLEM?

MARY HAS NOT DONE ANYTHING TO ANYONE HERE

WHY ARE YOU BOTHERING HER.

NO ONE ELSE HAS HAD ANY PROBLEMS WITH HER.

YOU STARTED THIS WITH HER YESTERDAY WHEN YOU WERE PRETENDING TO BE FROM LINCOLN NEBRASKA.

***THIS IS CALLED INTERNET STALKING*** AND COULD LAND ***YOU*** NOT HER IN TROUBLE

CHECK YOURSELF BEFORE YOU WRECK YOURSELF

BUH BYE!!

onehappychica,

watch Greta(near the end with tito)
or read my post forum34

everybody's ranting and raving is ---- , go for it. rant, rave, go nuts, what are yo achieving with that? huh?
go figure.

geechee: I bet it would be fun to watch you open a box cereal

BOBUP

are you still out there?

seedyrum-
Thank you! I'm scrolling upwards on 34 and trying to blend knowledge here!!

Did anything ever come on all the stuff that the psychic told searchers?

oh yes, got pester the troll's

Seedy, I had some solicitor come to the door when Greta was on about schizojoran's jail time. Did I understand him to say he had a "computer?" I am sure I heard that "out of context." Please clear that for me, what was said about computer, air conditioning on high (would that mean 100 degrees (?)high) or did he mean 32 degrees. Very confusing. I hope he meant 115 degrees, but then I expect 70 is high in that case, but what about the access to computer? Was that communication between him and the guards or what?

BOBUP

sorry you must have posted when i did.

this is good news what dan is planning to do next isn't it? I am looking forward to it.

i noticed your post to him : )

Does anyone know if the cadaver dogs found anything?

At the very least it is nice to know that at least one of her classmates was interested enough in the whereabouts of NH to call her cellphone at abt 3:15 am on the night whe went missing to try to find out where she was. Too bad that only her cell phone was in her room and not NH also.

HARRY

welcome!!!

I am back on earth at the moment!!

MrsJimiHendrix: yes it is :)

The cell phone call is key in this. It is going to put Natalee at a location such that the beach sattelite could not have seen her.

Well, maybe I need a spellchecker, satellite.

ABU RAJIR

GRETA IS AN AMERICAN

a very hard thing for you to grasp.

this country is a melting pot.

JIM BAKKER WAS DUTCH THEN TOO, AND IF YOU ASK ME, HE REPRESENTED YOU ALL BETTER THAN GRETA!!!

LMAO

Mrs. Jimi:

Sorry, I was inquiring if the cadaver dogs found anything.

Its very sad what some people will do for attention.
Its also sad that people are so jealous of others that are partiipating and continue to attack.
They attack each other. Not just the ones mentioned above.
SICKO LOSERS.

letsbefair: you should know that feeling

Who would tell you, harry, if they did know? You'd just try to use it as something to bash the victim with wouldn't you? This is a blog FOR Natalee so why do you come here except to try to make trouble.

So to answer your question, yes, someone knows. Go look it up yourself.

IHOP

out to go buy a new can of RAID

i kind of used up everything on that last one

LOL!!

I have another question, are all these people really illiterate or do they fake it? I have noticed that they constantly spell their names wrong. Is it Karen Janssen or Caren Jansen or Carin Jannson or Karin Janssen I have seen it in the aruban print media every way.

They speak a fake language, lie when their mouths are open, think drugs and drinking are fine for teens and wonder why we think they have problems.

Raj, Dutch blood runs through the genetics in this family as well, but hopefully none of VDS. The VDS family has no royal blood ties, wishful commoners.

Proudredneck

he said he would be left in a room without a chair in the dark for 5 hours and the aircondition turned up.


then questioned

Tito said the rooms are usully cool and the air condition make it even more so

how does she hold herself together: a little bird chirped that she always longed for an acting carreer and now she cannot pull herself away from the camera's - even for the price of leaving her 16 year old son at home alone (I hope they have a well-stocked bar) and slashing out at the juridical system of a befriended nation


Posted by: blacklable | July 7, 2005 01:23 AM

Blacklable,

that is just over the top.

i would never say this but i sort of wish anyone who could be so cruel should go through the same thing and see what it feels like!!

shame on you!!

Letsbefair,
So they looked and nothing was there?

Thank you, Anna! I guess I should ask the dogs.

blackbabble get back under the keyboard and clean up the mess. You are too disgusting to be here. Now runalong and tell mommy to tuck you in.

Thanx, I was worried. I may have thought "computer" when I heard "chair." I was going to listen again. I guess the solicitor was trying to sell me a computer chair :)

blacklable,
Why are you lying about her leaving the son at home alone? He isn't and have you forgotten the little sister? Trust me, they are NOT alone, that is illegal in this country, you know, child under twelve unattended. They have plenty of relatives who will mind the children for as long as this takes, years even, so don't trouble your little head about things that are none of your business. Why are you aksing about their other child? Thinking of kidnapping him, too??? Is that all you people think about!!

Really reaching tonight, aren't you? Nasty!

Do we need a list of the pissant trolls again?

Proudredneck...could you possibly be referring to the segment where Greta was interviewing the Kalpoe's attny I believe, and he was talking about one of the Kalpoe's being held in an air conditioned room in the dark...I guess this was painful somehow, and then he was interviewed in another room with a computer, evidently someone took down what was said, and then he had to sign it on the spot.

I confess I do not always pay complete attention to everything as so much is frequently repeated. Hope that helps.

"K" is Dutch .... "C" is German.

I am with Beth on finding where her daughter maybe.

If you were lost stolen dead, would you want someone to look for you?

give up hope and go home?

BOBUP

can you just imagine the trolls that will bring about!!!

blacklabel,

maybe next time, instead of chirping, the little bird will pluck your eyes out.

Do we need a list of the pissant trolls again?

Posted by: Island Hopper | July 7, 2005 01:29 AM

SURE!!

Law77
I will feed you one time here

May the demons of Satans hell rise from
the earth and bestow upon you what you
so rightly deserve. Burn in hell you
scumbag.

I am none of who you say I am and
the ones that you are putting down
should track you down and beat your
sorry scumbag ass. You are a piece
of trash, garbage, & toliet scum
weeks old.

Mrs Jimi,
I try not to wish that for it would mean the loss of their child, sister, mother, another innocent person but how about they have whatever happened to Natalee happen to them? Now that would seem completely fair, don't you think?

I'd be upset at the ones who brought this on my island, the Pride of Aruba, Joran and his gang he calls the Pimps. Have to wonder about those that always blame the victim, criminal predatory minds themselves.

BAMA GUY

GOOD ONE!!

Proudredneck

You did hear computer.

After being in the room in the dark for 5 hours they are then brought to interrogation room where there is a computer and the questioning begins

I hear less, and less about Natalee.
eveybody seems to be too much in themselves, rightous, hatred, bigotry, etc, etc.
gotta spout self riotuous sh**, thats whats happening,

PISSANT TROLLS TO BE IGNORED it is way past their collective bedtimes.

harry
letsbefair
blacklable
Billy Bob
LAW77

MAYBE WE SHOULD PUT
BLACKLABLE IN ONE OF
"P'S"
SNUFF VIDEOS!!

On other forums they are speaking a lot about the Abrams report tonight where Beth Holloway confirmed a call was made to Mississippi at around midnight (1am Aruba time) where someone claims to have kidnapped Natalee. Does anyone know about this? The Twitty's were already on the island by the time that call came through. Any clues or answers you guys? Or can anyone paste the Abrams transcript if you can find it?
Thanks, CancunGirl

You're welcome, harry. However, dogs tend to be excellent judges of character so I doubt you will get much there except maybe your sorry butt chewed off by one. I left you a note on another thread about your nasty assumptions and bad habit of always thinking the worst of others. Real negative person is harry.

Anna

Well said!!

I think American should file a class action suit against The Netherlands Daily Newspaper for Slander if the Kalpoe want to sue Beth.

The article slanders Americans!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


The following story appeared in the Dutch (regional) press about Aruba. The Netherlands Daily, Nederlands Dagblad, placed it in their front page.
American Teenagers party on Aruba
(From our correspondent Nina Jurna)
The missing teenager Natalee Holloway is portrayed in the media as a very correct, innocent, conservative eighteen year old girl that went on a school trip. Not a girl who goes to Aruba to party hard. But is that realistic? Because Aruba is the ‘Loret de Mar’ (The european Aruba) for American youngsters.
‘’You only hear on the Island that she stumbled out of the nightclub completely pissed'’.
Oranjestad - Arubans know: thousands of American youngsters come to the Island every month for sex, drugs and alcohol. On Aruba you may, in contrary to the US, drink when your 16 and for a joint you won’t end up in jail. ‘’Here they do everything that cannot and may not do at home'’, tells Gijs van ‘t Hullennaar. He is a manager of come bars and nightclubs, like Moomba Beach, a populair beach hangout adjacent to the Holliday Inn, where Natalee Holloway stayed. According to Van ‘t Hullenaar are the ‘excesses’ committed by Dutch Teenagers in the spanish costal cities like Loret de European European Mar and the isle popular Holiday are not popularing compared what the Americans do on Aruba.
Van ‘t Hullenaar Spanish coastal has met during his career in the bar business many different tourists from many different places. But the Americans are according to him the worst. ‘’The know no boundaries. They drink abnormally much, blow and use more drugs. Even the girls, the are possibly worse than the boys. They flirt with the barkeepers and ask for free drinks. ‘If we don’t have to pay, we rock this place’ they say. I have experienced sometimes that they dance on the bar and stripping'’.
In America youngster may only use alcohol after their 21th birthday, until then they do not enter a bar. On Aruba there are the much easier dutch rules . ‘’The young Americans do not enter a bar to have a few drinks, no they want to get completely wasted. Sometimes they just put a pile of dollar bills on the counter and ask ‘I want to get drunk as fast as possible’.
In the case of the missing teenager Natalee Holloway the police also talked to Van ‘t Hullenaar Spanish coastal European. ‘’This bar is right next to the Holiday Inn, so there was a great chance that she has been here. But I didn’t saw her that night. In the weekend she disappeared the south beach festival was held here and that drew a big crowd. Van ‘t Hullenaar Spanish coastal told career according experienced Fox dollar bills Holiday disappeared south beach Fox news the same story he told the police. ‘’A lot of American parents do not know what their children are doing here on Aruba. They give their son or daughter 300 dollars and I know that is mostly spend on alcohol. He thinks is it’s hypocritical to say that it’s all okay, even if it’s terrible that the girl is missing. ‘’But you only hear on the Island that she stumbled out of the nightclub completely pissed, not in the American press. Of course every parent tells: my daughter doesn’t do that. But that’s just what my parents told others about me’.

MAYBE WE SHOULD PUT
BLACKLABLE IN ONE OF
"P'S"
SNUFF VIDEOS!!

Posted by: MrsJimiHendrix


I hear they fetch five, sometimes six, grand in South America :)

Beth said she recieved a call from a cell phone(although she didnt say it in this interview) and there were backgrounds noises she rrecognized when she arrived and went into the VDS home.

Thanks Island Hopper for the update.


was she more specific than that seedy?

Seedyrum:
Tell me more? Was the call made to Mississippi, meaning to Dave Holloway or to whom?

professor, how long did it take you to produce that clever remark?
Bet you are one of those people who spends 24/7 in front of the computer and doesn't even know what the real life looks like anymore.
You should give it a serious try..go outside and see what life has to offer you, you might like it. And dont worry, you're learn how to interact with REAL PEOPLE eventually.

Roger, some people are just too stuck up.. I wouldnt even try to give these people some common sense, its hopeless. Let them feel important if that is what makes them happy.

And really.. I dont care what you all think about this comment. We're all entitled to our own opinion..And frankly, I think you're all one big joke.

IAMCANADIAN

The last week something happened

usually by this time of night though the cockaroaches are all back under their rocks!!

Dan is beginning to bring in other topics soon so hang tight!!

Thanks, Sleuth. That might have been it. I was half-listening as the solicitor was actually a policeman who had investigated a matter reported by us about a strange car parked in our driveway when I came home Wednesday morning: car running, doors and windows locked, lights off.

I wonder why the other security guard
has never spoken on camera about his
experience. You would think they would
want to sue the government for smearing
their names as they did.

Anna:

I had not realized how much my charming personality had commandeered this blog. Truly, you credit more than I deserve. Are we still looking for Natalee, or am I the object of concern now?

Just skim over the post by the trolls. Dont even read them. That really pisses them off.

Here is that list again.
harry
letsbefair
blacklable
Billy Bob
LAW77

Island Hopper,
I read something along those lines, just tye ing :carribean news" and you get all sorts of entries, lots of hits, I perused a whole lot of them, same thing as we've been reading. I did hit one, but did not save it as a favorite, and it was an aruban one. think it was a forum for 95?? dunno, some of it was in other language tho.

interesting how all of a sudden when
abu musab rajir bakker arrives
all these mystery people from holland come
along as well!!

Erin22-
Tim Miller lost his daughter years ago. He understands the pain and despair of the Holloway-Twitty family. He is joined by an all volunteer group as search efforts for Natalee continue.

Please do not let a "nutcase" assess this man's strong character.

It would have been informative if Greta had mentioned the name of the classmate who had rented one of the Croes digital phones and called
NH cell phone to check on her whereabouts at about 3:15 am the night she went missing. Someone who cared enough to try to find out where she was should be mentioned by name.

I wonder why the other security guard
has never spoken on camera about his
experience. You would think they would
want to sue the government for smearing
their names as they did.

Posted by: ! | July 7, 2005 01:42 AM

!

I think they are petrified

IHOP,

where's roger?

oh, add dutchgal to the list. she doesn't care what we think. ;)

IHOP AND BAMA GUY

tonight rename the Nightly Troll Report
the Friends of Theo Van Geogh Society

LOL!!

Og I was just listing the ones here now

GOTTA CHA !!
Just skim over the post by the trolls. Dont even read them. That really pisses them off.

Here is that list again.
harry
letsbefair
blacklable
Billy Bob
LAW77


Posted by: Island Hopper | July 7, 2005 01:43 AM

My heartfelt prayers and strength to Beth and family.

I had not realized how much my charming personality had commandeered this blog. Truly, you credit more than I deserve. Are we still looking for Natalee, or am I the object of concern now?

Posted by: harry

Harry, I can assure you that nothing "Dutch" will ever be the object of our concern.

BAMA GUY

it is more like she doesn't
THINK what we care!!!!!!!!!!!

blacklabel--
A piece of what we do all day long?? I did not know an innocent Aruban was missing with known suspects in this country! Please provide details. We will form search parties as always and have all forensic evidence preserved at once.

Who is this poor person and how can we help? You're not just lying about that, too, are you??

Hey guys! Just thought I would take a break from lurking to say hello. Kind of afraid to come around during the daytime, don't wanna get bit!
IHOP - Congrats!

IHop, just read that article you posted, slander is saying untruthful things about someone to a third party, that article was neither untruthful nor spoken.

Mrs Jimi,

You got that right.

BTW, I really love the Dutch. Those "Dutch Boys" really know their paint.

Hey Guys ,

were losing perspective. ?

IHOP

i have a feeling the Dutch wing of CAIR is still here tonight, may have stepped out to pray but they will be back soon!!!

Was the beheaded guy related to the other decurity guard?

Note the fishing expedition to garner information on the cell phone call. Those in a position to know more about this, please do NOT share with anybody on the internet. You may just be giving information to the very ones who should not have it in order for them to start their little cover up machine in action.

I know it was played to several here in Alabama including Cong. Bacchus and others but we do not want to take Beth's only leverage away from her and part of that is their not knowing just what she has.

I remember they hired private eyes at the beginning and hope they have collected some things as well.

ok Geechee It's libel if they can't prove that ALL American youth go to Aruba for sex, alcohol and drugs.

Iamcanadian,

you are right.

but its late...

I Hop, let me guess the name of the other judge==how about JONES?? Brahahaha!

Everybody disses each other, black, white, brown, brown, yellow, mixed etc etc
HEY!
KID IS MISSING. need i reiterate.

Roger,

Re: Your Scenario w/ JVDS & PVDS-

Joran is too stupid to watch CNN. Same with PVDS.

Thus, your theory doesn't work.

I often wondered why the other security gaurd never spoken out.

My guess shy, not articulate in front of the camera, has been warned, want distance self from this travesty.

However,

That isnt to say we wont hear from him at some time.

I am sure he is taking some notes or someone is on his behalf.


Even when things return to "normal", there will never be normalcy, a reporter will look him up to get his take on this miscarriage of justice.

Dont get me started on CAIR.

BIRMINGHAM GAL

HELLO

Good to see you!!

Bama Guy will tell you who I am in case you have not figured it out!!

I asked him how you have been. Glad you checked in with us!!

birminghamgal

i thought you had left us.

Yes, let's file a class action suit against all of those Arubans who have said Americans only go to Aruba to be drugged, raped and murdered and left in a shallow grave for that matter!!

So anyone have any theories about what kind of evidence Aruban Police has against Joran Van Der Sloot that would justify his continued detention?
--
My guess is: they already have a body and a confession.

IHOP

Ibrahim Hooper and company are here with rajir!!

GAG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Billy Bob: Good point. I don't know the details of that since Greta did not cover that. It looked like some of the interview was edited out at that place. I never did get it clear about that call, however it would make sense that it was Natalee's phone having a message on it that started the search for the source of the call.
Hope that Greta will cover that in some later show and answer some of those questions.
rick

That kind of coverage from the Dutch press doesn't surprise me any more. It doesn't even upset me any more, because I no longer have an "open mind" about the Arubans or the Dutch. sorry.
.

Wow...
Looks like we are in for a longggggg night
Yippie yi A.
Just skim over the post by the trolls. Dont even read them. That really pisses them off.

Here is that list again.
harry
letsbefair
blacklable
Billy Bob
LAW77


Posted by: Island Hopper | July 7, 2005 01:43 AM

IAMCANADIAN

DO NOT FRET

WE ARE HERE AND WE ARE NOT BACKING DOWN.

HANG IN THERE WITH US AND PASS OVER THE TROLLS.

CHECK FOR THE NIGHTLY TROLL REPORT BY IHOP AND USE IT FOR A REFERENCE

Hendrix, I knew who you were right when you changed your name! I've been out of town but I finally got caught up on the posts. Good to see everyone (that matters) is still around!

Zzzzz... ik ben zo slaperig.

jojo,

i beleive there is something to the "something bad happened" statement and/or confession.

I'm not Dutch nor have I ever been to Holland or Aruba.

RAJIR

layla tov!!

hehehe!!

Sleep tight Sami al Arian!!

Bama - No, haven't left..just been very busy. BTW, you're on a roll tonight!;)

This is a very unique LE and judicial system. It is not illegal to identify two innocent guards and try to implicate them in a missing persons investigation?? Ask one day and be told it certainly is, how dare you suggest that it isn't, you are being disrespectful to our system, blah, blah, blah,

Ask the next day, and sure you can lie like that! Depends on who is doing the lying and whom the victims happen to be.

But that alone would qualify them as criminals in this country where we still have a few morals, not many but a few.

But the reaction I hope makes it perfectly clear that this woman has good reason to have reared sons who do these sorts of things. Talk about greed, not enough what they have done but these money-grubbing bastards want to try to make money off making this girl disappear.

Like prof, I would not be surprised to learn the reason they have not found a body is that they ate her. Instead of making these jerks cough up what they know as any decent person would have done, she threatens to sue the family of their victim!

Every day these people and this island look more and more like a glimpse into hell itself.

How well has Aruba handled the investigation?
Not at all 51%
Somewhat 39%
Very 9%
Total Votes: 318,681

bamaguy1
always thought you were a two stepping cigar chewing tobacco spitting kinda guy. hey thanks,
I am from canada- northern canada- no I'm not an eskimo, am Indian - watch head! heheh(no scalping). Back here we kinda like no nonsense court cases. simple as that. But it can get complicated when the professionals have to get into it. I bet everybody in that island knows exactly what happened. because, i always did in my home town, people talk.

birmingham gal

we aren't going anywhere just getting stronger

combatting new forms of terrorism i suppose

LOL!!

Bamaguy:

That statement "something bad happened" was never spoken by Joran. It was spoken in error by the Police Chief or Deputy Polcie Chief to the media in the early stages of the investigation.

I did a search on psychics on the web and came across this one. Take it with a grain of salt, unless it turns out to be true!

Psychic search for Natalee

I tried using "The Mayan Oracle" cards (by Spilsbury & Bryner, Bear and Company Publishing, Santa Fe, NM), which are divination cards based on the Mayan calendar, to find out psychically where Natalee is. This is not something I normally do on the Revelation 13 web site, but desperate measures are called for here, since time is of the essence. On 6-19-05 I used these cards, writing down a question and then using the cards. These are the results, where I list the cards drawn and the Mayan Oracle interpretation:
1. Is Natalee alive in Venezuela now?
Cards: Muluc (signals, signs), 7 (mystical power), 5 (core purpose), 1 (unity). Interpretation: Signal-751. Perhaps this is a coordinate? 7.51 North does go through Venezuela.
2. Will Natalee be found alive within a month (30 days) (from June 19)?
Cards: Etznab (timelessness), Akbal (abyss, mystery), Transformer, Oc (breakthrough)
Interpretation: I take this as a yes, Natalee will be found alive within 30 days.
3. Coordinates of where Natalee is?
Cards: Caban (centerdness), Akbal (abyss, mystery), 9 (greater cycles), Shadow, Cimi (release), Chicchan (vitality).
Interpretation: Possibly this indicates 9.000 Degrees North in South America.

Next I tried using "The Book of Runes", by Ralph Blum, St. Martin's Press, New York. This is a Viking Rune Stone Oracle, where I wrote down the question and I chose 3 Rune Stones.
1. Will Natalee be found alive within 30 days?
Stones: Thurisaz (gateway of the divine), Warrior, Possessions.
Interpretation: I take this as a yes, Natalee will be found alive within 30 days.

Visualize: I've tried to psychically visualize by psychic powers a vision of where Natalee is. I saw a very foggy vision, like through a glass darkly, of a waterfall and a mountain, which may be where she is (on June 24). My guess is that this is in South America. This could be a description of a location in Rio de Janeiro, Brazil, with the mountain and waterfall. The kidnappers may be keeping her out of sight until the publicity dies down, since CNN is watched all around the world, and they are afraid that she will be recognized. So she may be held out of sight now in South America.

I still go back to that top polis official giving that statement during week one: one of the suspects (joran?) has confessed to killing her and is leading them to the crimescene.

blacklable,
Please stop stalking the Twitty's other children! That is not very funny, you know, given the circumstances that one of you made their daughter disappear. Is one not enough??

bamaguy11

I have always wondered where that statement
"SOMETHING BAD HAPPENED" came from.

I do not believe they took her to the beach that
they have all agreed on now either.

Nite all. I hope the updates come faster tomorrow.

ANNA,

bear in mind there are those who actually believe Michael Jackson is innocent too!!

How well has Holloway Twitty handled herself during the investigation?
Very 63%
Somewhat 28%
Not at all 9%
Total Votes: 316,270

IHop, that is a list of people you do not like. Is that the standard that we are using? That is as low as it gets "they disagree with me then they must be a troll". You don't always speak the truth in here yourself, but if someone calls you on it, "troll". You have probably sent some of these names to Dan to have them kicked out because they disagreed with you. How long have you been out of the states? Thats is as un American as it gets sister.

lets face it. what updates? Whe will just speculate.! Again.

Island hopper, do we need to update the list now.

Please post. thanks

jojo,
that would mean they are allowing these divers to risk their lives while they are holding the corpse. Putting the family, friends and nation through all of this when they have the body would be beyond sick and cruel.

It has occurred to me that what you suggest is exactly what happened and why all the Arubans stopped looking so quickly. Are they holding the body and blackmailing Beth that if she releases whatever she is holding they will not give her the body and will let Joran walk??

Standoff.

I think the Kalpoes did take Joran and Natalee to the beach behind the Marriot. However, after the Kalpoes left, Joran and Natalee went into the Marriott Hotel where Joran's buddies are located.

Hendrix, terrorism is a good term. I'm thinking they must have some good, solid evidence from what Jug told Greta. I also think the F16's are a JOKE.

bear in mind there are those who actually believe Michael Jackson is innocent too!!

Posted by: MrsJimiHendrix | July 7, 2005 02:08 AM

Funny you mention that. I noticed that several of the Aruban sites on the net still have photos of the celebratory walk!!! They must think child moletation is OK if you can afford to pay someone off.

That fateful Friday night a few weeks ago when word when out from the Deputy Chief of Police that Joran had admitted killing her and was going to give up where her body was, I suspect that was the truth and he was made to retract that statement and in fact, I would not be surprised that the police have found her body and are holding it as a hostage kind of thing hoping the Holloway-Twitty family will go away.

If you recall, Dave had already gone to the site where it was supposed to be.

I think that was the truth and I still think it to be the truth and I think Papa vanderSleeze made the police retract it and use it against the family.

I still think they know she is dead, but as long as "papa advised them if there is no body, there is no crime," they will tow the line.

Did the Aruban government pay all their government workers (like they did for that superficial hunt) to go out and protest today? Wasted tax dollars as someone just said on a phone call they had no idea what they were protesting, but had been told Ms. Twitty was saying bad things about Aruba, and after they heard what she "really said," they agreed with her. Just one small phone call I got, but what about the rest of the people there? Want to bet the situation is the same with them.

still go back to that top polis official giving that statement during week one: one of the suspects (joran?) has confessed to killing her and is leading them to the crimescene.

Posted by: Jojo | July 7, 2005 02:06 AM

The police said that? Well just how many days does it take JVDS to lead someone to a body? It's been what? 36 days?

I was going to go to bed, but I wanted to share this one last thought with you. I got an email from someone calling herself Mayra Oduber. Mayra Oduber , and her message was "Dear stupid obnoxious American…uhm that’s all I will say by the way!"

She actually took the time to write that. Oh, well. This time I really am going to bed.

Prof and Moonshadow,
Should a letter be sent to all congresscritters or which ones, what committee is over this mess with the money laundering drug dealers like those with whom we are dealing in Aruba?

Also is anybody making a link of list of all the contacts, please, please, please??

Iamcanadian,

thanks...i guess. :)

Do you live in Sicily?

it really would be no surprise to me if...joran confessed and later was given the opportunity to retract his statement.

btw, i made a joke about Canada a few days past. it was meant in good humor.

geechee go suck an egg or email Dan or go cry in your pillow. I don't care.

birmingham gal

yes what a waste of $$$ or maybe not, a fast way to move the drugs, a more efficient way to move things around (and i don't mean related to this case)

an excellent diversion like how we were so focused on foreign affairs we were not paying attention to all the outsourcing going on!! so "look at all we are doing" when in reality they were outsourcing a few of their own goods or importing, whatever the case may be!!

Hey I HOP
US courts let him off.
what up with that?
their idiot judges- is what,

GOTTA CHA !!
Just skim over the post by the trolls. Dont even read them. That really pisses them off.

Here is that list again.
harry
letsbefair
blacklable
Billy Bob
LAW77
Roger
rick
Geechee just made the list for being obnoxious

Hey I HOP
US courts let him off.
what up with that?
their idiot judges- is what,


Posted by: Iamcanadian | July 7, 2005 02:14 AM

No, dear that would be a PAID jury.

PROFESSOR

SEND THE EMAIL TO DAN AND PLEASE CHANGE YOUR EMAIL ADDY ON HERE

THANK YOU

ATLEAST WE ALL KNOW HER NAME NOW!!

The confession and crime scene were all media specualtion from the statement by the senior policeman (Chief or Deputy) who said "Something bad must have happened" when queried as to why Joran was being interviewed so late into the night. Then, it took on a life of its own.

wow

Did anyone think to search in one of the Freezer of the Holiday Inn or Marriott Inn

Since he said something bad happened to Natlaie and was going to lead to the body.

The body is (was ) on the island. By now they have probably shifted the bosy who knows where.


It was on the isnald do boubt about it, now its a coverup


Watch Greta at 3am next 45 minutes.

Professor you have to be kidding!!!

bamaguy11,

hokie doke. eh! I'am not wearing a toque by the way.

Anna,
It seems the most probale at this point. No other evidence points to anything else. We've seen the mess that became Aruba during week one of this investigation. I think it is a matter of national economic security to them to keep what ever new developments under tight lip. Mariaine Croes, the spokesperson for the Aruban prosecutor was somehow released of her duties after devulging new information (at the time) that they intended to prosecute for mUrder and kidnapping. We got a glimpse of the real charges with the detention of Paulus Van Der Sloot. The 'discovery phase' of this process has been kept secret: Beth keeps saying she wants to take her daughter back. I too thought about why the search parties? PR stunt maybe? They are still trying to piece together what really happened and who else may have been involved. Or they may only have a confession and no body. Sorry, been a while since I posted. I needed to pull back..

Thanks IH

The polis have changed their stories more times than Joran!! And as for Michael Jackson, the only difference is that these people would make a video of it and sell it on the internet. Maybe that is why blacklable is so obsessed with the other Twitty children. They have found themselves a hole and just cannot seem to quit digging!

No, they are lying to the people of Aruba about why we are upset but the truth will come out including how they covered for little Dutchie Joran and his father and the locals just may not be as thrilled about that as the Dutch are.

And it is on record that Paulus was telling the three no corpse no case on Monday, before any of them should have even known Natalee was missing at all. Odd how so many knew for a fact she was missing. You'd think they would just assume she took a later fligth. Unless of course you knew that was impossible because you knew exactly what happened.

IHOPP
you got that right, ughhhhh!! MJ = no kids.

IHOP/IAMCANADIAN

here is what i think happened in MJ case

ppl on jury got scared of MJ's people. they are powerful, like the powers that be in aruba!!

NOI is incharge of MJ's affairs, brother Jermain is a NOI member. DANGEROUS GROUP, even Islam does not recognize them as true muslims.

NOI is going to take all his $$$ and suck him dry, but in the meantime they will scare off anyone who comes between them and their new cash cow.

so if jury found him guilty there would have been a VERY angry group in this country who would have found these jurors

i hope police chief is being protected cuz NOI soes not play

by the way

NOI = Black KKK

No Doubt!!!!!!!!

Racists!!!!!!!

you not for real are you. Troll, real one asleep.

seedyrum

Yes,GRETA AT 3:00, thats why I am still up. yawn....
Hope I can last.:O)
I really feel so bad for Beth.
This has been a nightmare for her
and she did nothing wrong.


MsHendrix, Actually I believe they were afraid of the riots that would follow if he were convicted, no doubt led by NOI. But the jurors were so anxious to get their book written I had to rethink it.

prof, did you save the email including headers? Sounds like hate mail to me or stalking of some sort. I would forward it to the authorities.

what's on the docket with greta v s?

i missed the original broadcast today.

getting sick of watching alan combs(over) & robert boink, i mean bork

no IAMCANADIAN

that is me

this is true

i was typing it all fast b/c it was a lot to write

it's me alright. lived and breathed hollywood for years. i know what i am talking about.

Just to reiterate some earlier info I had posted that annoyed the trolls:

A little info on Ben King. He seems to have a problem with the US and especially the war in Iraq.

http://benking.com/actnow/

I am betting that Van der Sloot, Van Straaten and few others belong to his gold key club too and this is only part of the information the Holloway-Twitty's want to release. I'd hate to think that the tourist $$ spent in Aruba are being used to support terrorists. But I suspect that is the case because of a few VERY corrupt individuals on that island.
No I don't think that is why Natalee was kidnapped, but because the family had to investigate the kidnapping since the Polis would not, they uncovered this information while they were at it just like we have.

Volgens mij is er nog steeds geen lijk. Hoewel ik persoonlijk niet geloof dat sletje Natalie nog leeft heb je volgens mij juridisch totaal geen zaak. Trouwens ik ben 1 keer op Aruba geweest en van mij mogen ze alle Amerikanen aan de haaien voeren. Op Aruba heb ik een gigantische hekel gekregen aan dit volk, ik heb nog nooit in mijn leven zoveel eikels en dombo's bij elkaar gezien.

a little more:

About the Kyoto agreement and this little club.

http://64.233.179.104/search?q=cache:C3SewGON0GMJ:econpapers.repec.org/article/eeeecolec/default35.htm+%22Kyoto+protocol%22+straaten&hl=en&lr=lang_en

Wow Jan Van der Straaten is one of the authors huh?

And wasn't Paulus Vander Sloot ostrisized for his "environmental" stance on a road that would save children's lives but take his property in Holland?

Jimi,
hoki doke,
kinda nice to talk to people that are'nt spoutin' hatred ad all that.

IHOP

i thought of that too. i remember the night of the jury delibs on the reginal denny trial.

the whole town was on hinges.

NOI found a good one in him b/c he is desperate to change his ways and they don't put up w/ that kind of crap, no homosexual activity whatsoever (so they say), definately no kid stuff.

but also a lot of other things not good as we know!!

Just think now they will have as much $$$$ in Hollywood as the Church of Scientology!! LOL!!

jojo,
maybe that is why they have obstructed the search teams, know they can be injured or even killed and do not need more bad PR but maybe afraid the dogs will find all kinds of other bodies besides NH all over paradise. Cannot ever remember any country rejecting volunteer search teams.

Supposed to be given a break by team from New York state any time now, are they not? And none have ever seen the uniform of the Dutch marines. Nice! Tell the world we are sending one hundred marines to assist them then just don't do it, lie about it.

And heard today the PM tried to deny sending Shelby the letter asking for divers. What is wrong with these people, did he not know Shelby was standing there holding the letter??

This just gets stranger and stranger every day! Then late today, heard the divers were back on. And they are supposed to be our friends. We would have been given better cooperation from the Ruskies at the height of the cold war on a humanitarian effort like this.

I would be vociferous about this or any other case about Violence Against Women and Children

Beth gives me strength. (seems like Tug said that he did he did)

She is determined to find out some credible answers to some credible questions.

Where is Natalee and what, who why and how?

this is a symbiotic relationship

Conservative government, we know you don't believe there is a body and no one is going to feed me or you to the sharks, although I might like to feed some people to them.

Like no kidding, I want Natalee to be here, but were reaching, I do not want to do that, but after these weeks, I know were just hoping. I know. I've been there.

conman thinks they should feed all Americans to the sharks but he is a troll too so

WHO CARES?????????????????

Iamcanadian

just telling the truth of what made the jury let him go.

sorry if it sux.

I could not make a story like that up if you paid me.

Done my years in the business and in Hollywood, over and out!!

IHOP

conman is a hitler youth!!

Why does Sean Hannity dominate the show?

He almost attack the guests on his show.

There would be no show without the guests.

He is real rude and domineering and interrupt his guests as if that make him right.

Where is Alan Combs, why is he soo soft quiet less forceful?

Sean H gets 5 questions to Alan .1 question.

gutten tag con man!!

sig Hiel!!

like you are never gonna procreate, proudredneck!

I just emailed the Editor of Time Magazine, requesting the requirements for nominating
Beth Holloway Twitty for Time Magazine's 2005 Woman of the Year. When I receive a responding email I will post it here on Dan's blog...

I heard that LORANA BOBBIT
is going to be vacationing
in ARUBA real soon. She
is looking for a date
with a Dutch boy
and couple of brothers
for a double date and she
carries a Big knife too!
LOL
:o)

Het moet niet gekker worden! Ik lees net in de Arubaanse krant dat die moeder van nathalie 200 duizend dollar van de Arubaanse regering wilt om zo die CSI van texas te betalen (mams heeft druk geoefend op de amerikaanse amabasade op Aruba, die moest druk uitoefenen op Nederland en Nederland moest druk uitoefenen op de Arubaanse regering voor het geld)
De minister die gaat niet akkord lees ik. "over my dead body" zei hij letterlijk....
Blijkt dat de regering van Aruba alle verblijfkosten van de hele familie Holloway betaald. Lokale bevolking die vanaf dag een hebben meegeholpen met het zoeken en nog steeds zoeken hebben geen rooie cent ontvangen.
Volgens de krant is die CSI uit texas puur uit voor een snoepreisje naar Aruba net zoals de amerikaanse tvzenders.

Voor degen die papianments kunnen lezen...de krant van gister:
http://www.diarioaruba.com/diamars/noticia/news4.html

So if this were the case, wouldn't the government of Aruba give us what we want to get us out of there? The longer this case is scrutinized, the more the chances that all this corruption will be discovered?

seedy rum

go to www.hannity.com

voice your opinion on his forum

but first read through it b/c you may actually like it.

Anyone out there know who to petition for a new international law? UN? How do you start?

I think we need a LAW that allows for the rights to a missing persons family to be able to call on thier home country authorities for support from anywhere in the world....and that would require cooperation from the authorities in the country/countries in question.

The Truth.
I did that as well and I got a
response back.
Will go and look for it.
:O)

hendrix
never paid you a dime !

Where did that statement come from?


Police investigating the disappearance of an Alabama teenager in Aruba said one of three young men in custody has admitted “something bad happened” to her during her island visit.

Deputy Police Commissioner Gerold Dompig told The Associated Press that the man was leading police late Friday to the scene. He refused to identify which of the three young men who took her to a beach the night she disappeared made the statement

RealPotential, VERY good idea.

birmingham gal

what i think is going on is that they got caught after many many many cover ups. to give up whatever is going on here is going to open up a huge can of worms that is going to humiliate the powers that be in aruba that they are not prepared to expose at this point in time

like i heard once in traffic school you get caught once for every 65 times you speed

The Truth...Here is my response back from them.
-------------------------------------------------

In a message dated 6/29/2005 9:03:24 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time, letters@time.com writes:

Dear Reader:

Thank you for letting us hear from you. The editors appreciate the
interest that prompted you to write, and they have made attentive note of
your comments. We hope that you will continue to share your thoughts with
us.

Best wishes.

TIME Letters

I hop
we can keep speulating.

I do not want to hear another troll say the US press made this statement up. Your Deputy Police comissioner said it. He probably got fired for telling the truth! I hope Beth finds him.

Police investigating the disappearance of an Alabama teenager in Aruba said one of three young men in custody has admitted “something bad happened” to her during her island visit.

Deputy Police Commissioner Gerold Dompig told The Associated Press that the man was leading police late Friday to the scene. He refused to identify which of the three young men who took her to a beach the night she disappeared made the statement

Hendrix, so I guess they would rather let the media disclose all this juicy info? Sounds a little like russian roulette to me. Makes me wonder if Greta reads this blog...GO GRETA! So if you ever come to Alabama, let me know so I won't be on the roads!:)

I wonder if the POW's of all the wars would like some of these naysayers to look for them or BHT?

the naysayers would say , dont look for them , they are dead body eaten by animals of the forest or out to see.

The naysayers would tell the families of the POW's move on, get married again get on with your life, shut up, the goverment is doing all it can.
dont picket the goverment, dont have the goverment to keep flying airplanes over Korea or even Vietnam.


I wonder what Sen John McCain would have said or Pvt Lynch or to others like them such as
http://www.pow-miafamilies.org/

I wonder what do these naysayers say to those returning from war broken, missing limbs , eyes, teeth, half crazy or even all crazy.

Shut up the war is over , you got a few cuts or broken bones they will heal, get some dentures, you dont have PTSD, stop faking.

What will the naysayers say to those who havent given up hope for that is all the families have to hang on to their loved one.

What do the naysayers say?

IHOP

did Adolf say that? I didn't notice

following the nightly troll report!!

I'm gonna have to call it a night...my eyeballs are having issues. Peace everyone!

Iam going to bed.

Dom mens. Moet ze haar sletterige dochter eens wat meer onder controle houden. BreEzAhtje zelf zit waarschijnlijk ergens in Venezuela met een nieuwe toy boy. Heeft ze in het verleden ook al geflikt..

birmingham,

legal reasons.

without "proof" anything said would be slander.

much like kalpo's mother who is now attempting to sue Beth TH. without proof or conviction one cannot call someone/something in the media something without legal repercussions.

greta

if you read this

tell bruce jeffer

his cousin

says

HELLO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Now the Aruban press is claiming that Beth is demanding the Aruban government to pay $200,000 to Equusearch.
http://www.diarioaruba.com/diamars/noticia/news4.html

seedyrum
been in war have yeh?

SEEDY

good analogy

BHT is the one going to have major PTSD and all the loved ones.

Natalee = POW MIA but NOT TO DIMINISH OUR MEN AND WOMEN IN ANYWAY!!

figures, figures, figures............

Americans murdered in the u.s. in june: 1200
American children gone missing in the
u.s. for a prolonged period in June 600
Americans killed in iraq in june 74
Americans gone missing in Aruba in June 1

American dollars spend in iraq in june 1.700.000.000
American dollars spend in Aruba in june 50.000.000

Talking about misguided media attention

Dirk

Very scary and I hope we can all explore more of this as time goes on here.

I believe that this case was just the begining of more to come with Dan

dirk van dumberthan a rock,
this board is for Natalee Holloway in case you can not read. If you want to whine about America go to www.whinersrus,com

So if this were the case, wouldn't the government of Aruba give us what we want to get us out of there? The longer this case is scrutinized, the more the chances that all this corruption will be discovered?

Posted by: birminghamgal | July 7, 2005 02:40 AM

--
The Aruba government wants to resolve this no matter what. This is no longer about how the world sees their system, but also how their own citizens are viewing them. The question was raised why the suspects were released and not interrogated further. They held the 2 black former security guards, they supposedly held Paulus and marely took a statement but no interrogation. There was also question about the integrity of their system: PVDS is/was an acting judge. Joran, a minor, frequents establishments limted to those 18 and older; if JVDS did slip NH a drug with disastrous results, who did he get it from? If this was indeed a crime, it happened on their soil and no matter how much we scream, they will continue to lead the way, up to and including, mis-leading the press. Their system leaves no room for emotions, so I wouldn't be surprised if Beth has been told the truth but has also sworn to secrecy pending the investigation. Somethings she may not have control over along the way: like the release of the Kalpoes. Although their prosecutor feels they are suspects, the reviewing judge felt that, whatever evidence was on hand on them, was not enought to warrant further detention. What makes this a unique case is that it took place on foreign land. If an Aruban citizen were killed while visiting here, we would investigate and no one would ever be extradited.

IHOP

greta back on!!

jojo

birmingham went to bed

CALIFORNIA
KANSAS
PENNSLYVANIA

deepak spoke to greta

Misguided media attention= missing alabama kid

Waht up with that?
I'm pissed offed and I am Canadian! for heavens sake. Find her.

Dagelijks verdwijnen er tieners in Amerika (kijk maar op de pakken melk en de aanplakbiljetten op rest areas en bij de Walmart).
Jammer voor Joran dat het nu even cucumber-time is en Fox er bovenop is gesprongen...

!

what about California, Penn, and Kansas?

The corrupt idiots running Aruba have been feeding the islanders a steady stream of propaganda, drugs and alcohol. They are shocked when they can not run roughshod over Americans like they do over the islanders.

The threats to rejail Mickey John today were very real. They want him to shut up. He is NOT supposed to say that PAUL VANDER SLOOT told the boys how to COVER UP THE CRIME.

Greta teased that she would talk to Deepak and he would tell about Jorans 14 different statements that implicated him and Satish. He knew these existed because he saw and read the printed statements signed by Joren. But by the time the show aired, that segment was pulled. Was he arrested or just threatened? Or worse?

IHOP

are you on that sm.net?

Dompig made the statement "something bad happened." The rest was media frenzy and heresay. The Prime Minister had to step in and correct the error.

Re a high-ranking police oficial telling reporters that a suspect said "something bad happened" and was going to lead police to the crime scene. What do we know about the man who said it to reporters? Has he been heard from lately? How does he explain it?

going to bed, husband - not angry yet. hehehe

without "proof" anything said would be slander.

much like kalpo's mother who is now attempting to sue Beth TH. without proof or conviction one cannot call someone/something in the media something without legal repercussions.

Posted by: MrsJimiHendrix | July 7, 2005 02:53 AM

---
Not to diminish her efforts, but Beth needs to tread lightly. Always felt that from the start. Her going to the Van Der Sloot household in Aruba, would be considered harrassment in the US. Notice how Dave Holloway has kept in the background? Agree that the Kalpoe mom wants to sue for degradation. This may be the forst step to Beth losing the Aruban people's sympathies; Beth stay together..

Correction..... one of the suspects said "something bad happened" to Deputy Police Commissioner Gerold Dompig. He simply repeated it but failed to say which one.

well this woman is beautiful and i am sure long before her daughter went missing there were those who were insanely jealous of her

when i first heard she was 45 years old i was shocked. she doesn't look any older than 32!!

IHOP

I was going to give you my email address at sm.net I will email dan

No, Dompig made that statement all by himself. None of the persons in custody ever made that statement.

Volgens mij is iemand onschuldig tot het tegendeel is bewezen, ook in Amerika. Moeder is zeker helderziend. Nou ja anders kopen ze toch een andere schuldige. De familie is waarschijnlijk niet gewend aan tegenspraak en is nu pissed-off.

I do not want to hear another troll say the US press made this statement up. Your Deputy Police comissioner said it. He probably got fired for telling the truth! I hope Beth finds him.

Police investigating the disappearance of an Alabama teenager in Aruba SAID one of three young men in custody has admitted “something bad happened” to her during her island visit.

Deputy Police Commissioner Gerold Dompig told The Associated Press that the man was leading police late Friday to the scene. He refused to identify which of the three young men who took her to a beach the night she disappeared made the statement

hey jojo!!

i understand what you are saying!!

i just wonder how rational any mother is in a situation like this, you know?

I do not know what i would be like in her shoes. I think i would just die. I think someone would be dead!!

well one thing about this time of night is that it is calm here : )

What I dont uderstand why turn the Kalpoes loose without restriction on their travel??

Why did they want to leave Aruba soon after being set free?

Did they not have ties to Aruba? job, school, friends, home, gf(i hope not shudder the thought)

Unless the LE and/or the Aruba goverment encounrage them to leave town so as not to be able to testify against JVDS.

Oh yes sure they could have extradited but would the Aruba (the extradition would be stymied with lies, cant be found or other nonesenes}

It is now known that the 2 black men have nothing to do with this case, so why cant they speak their piece?

They are still under suspicion?

I am still wondering why they were rounded up like cattle in the predawn raid while sleeping with guns drawn by police?

However

The police dance two stepped their way in PVDS home. The police probably asked, "Pretty please can we take your car. we promise not to do a credible foresnsics investigation of it. If we find anything we will bury with whever the body is located. (wink wink) They didnt round up the VDS like cattle.


No no not like cowboys.


The words "can't go in there like cowboys with live in infamy with this case." as spoken by Karin Jannsen

She is actually working for the PVDS

She isnt trying to resolve this case by how the 2 blacks men were arrested in contrast to how JVDS was arrested.

I am a cowboy.

LOL

seems Hitler here enjoys talking to himself!!

check it out!! scroll up!!

toooo funny!!

If I made your troll list IHop, it must be a damn nice list.

This case is a mystery IHop and some people come in here to meet and try and see if they can solve it. Some come in here out of concern for Natalee. Some come here to bad mouth the police.Some come in here for amusement. Some come in here defending their countries from verbal attacks, as any good American would. Some come in here from the tourist boards of other islands seeing a chance to devert Aruba's tourist dollars. But ya know IHOP some come here strictly out of sheer hatred, and I must say I guess I am pretty sheltered out here in the middle of nowhere but, I truly did not know that there were still people in America that have that much hatred bottled up inside them. If nothing else you'd think they could be happy they were lucky enough to be born in the USA when most of the world wasn't.

IHop this story is obviously a big story to you and all the people who come in here. It is very big for greta and fox who are playing like American Idols but if you pickup the paper in any major city you would almost have to hunt for news on this case.

Most of America and the rest of the world have moved on. They are satisfied the right guy is behind bars for the time being and they will let it play out in court.

I feel very much for the mother but some in here talk about this woman who they have never met like she was a saint. Believe me there are a lot of parents in the South that are saying to themselves, "what was she thinking, I would never have allowed my child to go on a trip like that. She's a mother who is grieving and that is sad but she is not a saint. You can bet her ex who probably knows her better than anyone does not think she is a saint. I bet the word that comes to his mind starts with a C.

The father was totally against the girl going off with a bunch of kids to some island where he knew they were going to be running around half naked with no real supervision. He won't even get close enough to her to be in a picture because he does not like her at all right now. He will never see his daughter again because his ex wife overruled him and said what could possibly happen to her?

Finally IHop as unfortunate as this is there are much bigger problems in America and the rest of the world. I don't care what side you are on in the war in Iraq, the fact is there 135,000 American men and women fighting in a foreign land and for the most of them, everyday life is hell on earth and that is just the living conditions. The fact that they face life and death every minute while we just sit here and trade insults is enough to know there are much bigger stories.

These people who are writing the state department and acting so high and mighty need to get a grip. Why don't you try writing the damn pentagon every damn day and tell them to quit putzing around and get those troops some damn armour instead of saying it takes time while my fellow Americans die everyday. There are companies right now telling the pentagon they can have armour to the troo[ps in a matter of weeks and the answer they get is thanks but we don't need your help.

While our troops die on a daily basis supposedly to defend our freedom, one can come in here and have you IHop put there name on some list because they dare to challenge something they think you are wrong about or disgree with you.

When you think about real crisis going on in the world we here are as small as a fly on the butt of a bull stanmding next to the grand canyon.

Take your list and shove it. I think I'll leave you to bad mouth me. I'm sure you will try and have be barred and might very well succeed but I'm gonna go write a couple of emails to the pentagon. CYA

A L O H A

seedy

ride em cowboy!!

yee haw!!

Conman, go back and tell your cronies that the family will not accept any other culprit except BOTH Vander Sloots and only IF the Kalpoes testify AND go to her and personally apologize for not being forthcoming from the beginning.

Also, the family wants the truth about what happened to Natalee.

Now run and tell your corrupt cronies that message.

geechee:

You reside in good company!

Geechee if you had a half a brain you might be dangerous. I have 2 children fighting to keep this country free so STFU.

Geechee, I have been one of those troops. I want to know what you are talking about.

I have seen men die. I have come close to dying. Fortunately, not yet. These men have a purpose and it is a higher and loftier goal. It is protecting the freedoms that you so enjoy, like writing silly nonsensical letters to the Pentagon. Yes, we are all flies specks on the butt of the overall picture. It is a big one, but it takes each one of these little specks to bring about change. Don't preach to me about Iraq, not until you have been there or had a loved one there. I will not go back. Time is up but I went to Vietnam, went to Iraq. Where were you?

Gee and harry is you good company so enjoy yourselves.

The mark of superior achievement on this blog is making the troll list.

Island hopper

to further substantiate what you have already said

http://www.nationalledger.com/scribe/archives/2005/06/missing_teen_in.shtml

Rdy Croes was reported to have said it as well

Oh my goodness.
What was that.

Its raining frogs.

Ih
carry on.

geechee,

I agree with one of your statements. We are currently at war against terrorism around the world. There are much bigger concerns within the US. However, this is a Natalee Holloway forum. If this forum means so little to you, then leave.

proud redneck

i was just emailing dan, so i am not sure what you are talking about but God bless you for what you have been through

it may not mean much to you but my next door neighbor has the government contract which is overseeing the renovation of the pentagon follwowing 911

now i will go back and read what is going on that i missed but i am falling asleep!!

OK Island hopper.I will fly down to Aruba tomorrow and use my connections.I will tell my cronies that a 300 pound slob that is on the internet 20 hours a day demands the Van der Sloots be arrested because Sherlock Hopper speculates and has no evidence.They should listen to me.Anything else you want me to pass along?

That Ruben Trapenaburg is one snappy dresser. I bet he's "rolled" once or twice in those Aruban raves.

!,
I posted this earlier today. I can't focus on the war in Iraq.

Read enough of my posts and you'll no why I get sick of some of these trolls. If it bothers you, accept my apology and skip over them or just skip all my posts. There are plenty of other posters here that I have learned so much from and shared so much with.

I dont claim to be the smartest person on the planet, I do like to learn and share and learn more. I believe that information sharing is the best form of education available if you use it to your advantage. It surely has it's pitfalls, like dealing with troublemakers.

I am human. I have many faults and emotions. I have two children serving in the military and I have a great deal of respect for the USA. So if I get a bit testy with American bashers, I hope you can understand why. My daughter gave birth this morning and I will not see my grandson for probably 6 months or longer because my daughter chose to serve the great USA, like her father and her grandfather.

I have not seen my youngest son in almost 2 years. He writes to me often to say that he is so proud of his work in Iraq. He tells me how happy the Iraqi people are to be freed of the terrorist regime they have lived under. Sure there are still a lot of problems, but the Iraqi's think it is better than it has been in forever.

I hope you understand.

Posted by: Island Hopper | July 6, 2005 04:55 PM

So when some troll comes in and starts attacking me for not caring about the US soldiers I get a little hot under the collar.

IMPORTANT:

TALIBAN SAYING THEY HAVE MISSING US SERVICEMAN IN AFGANISTAN, JUST REPORTED ON FOX.

IHOP

WHEN I GET YOUR EMAIL I WILL TELL YOU ABOUT SOME STUFF I ALREADY TOLD DAN ABOUT

If the deputy of Police Commissioner isnt an official then who is??
If Ministry of Justice Rudy Croes arent official, what are those titles??

Who has a right to speak out??

Both Gerold Dompig and Rudy Croes, have official sounding titles said "somthing bad happened and he was leading them to the body."

Now what is that?

Karin Janssen is working for the PVDS

They sending in aircraft in 2-3 weeks after the fact is nothing but window washing.

Reuben Trapenberg Aruban gov't spokesperson isnt objective.

Why can Reuben talk but the Gerold D. and Rudy Croes cant speak??

Is a spokeperson for the govt higher on the "corrupt" chain than Deputy Police Commissioner and the Ministry of Justice

Thanks Dan. :O)

Rueben Trappenberg... isn't he the guy on that assmotion rave website? with all the really sleazy pics.

himmler

you speak english?

Con Ment:

I think you just made the troll list .... Welcome!

Latest rumour from Aruba shown on Dutch TV:
One of Natalee's best friends stated that the night before she disappeared, they went swimming while being drunk and having used coke. They were hardly able to reach the shore. Perhaps the next night she didn't reach the shore at all?

Comedians on strike all over the world and one has to come out of the closet.

another missing girl in birmingham

nancy lewis

from brimingham, AL

black female!!

car found off of Arkadelphia Rd in Birmingham

Yeah I Heard this earler.

Glad Greta tries to be fair and balanced.
:O)

sceptic,

it's hard to reach shore when you got a 190 lb Dutch guy on your back.

!

she has been missing since MAY 18TH!!

Dompig & Croes cannot talk, because they muffed the "something bad happened" statement and allowed a torrent of media frenzy. Now, only the PM amd MOJ can release information.

Wonder why the family took so long to get the story out there. ?? Thats a long time

Riehl's dictionary:

sceptic.... a septic tank with a view

! and bama and IHOP etc

i told dan that i would chip in to help him set up a forum for us so that we could post privately.

i told him to sign up for pay pal so that i could help.

i know that it is not expensive to run a forum, i just don't have the time, but would be happy to help the only way i can

CHARGE IT!! LOL!!

i think there are some wonderful ppl here, just too many dam trolls!!

Billy Bob: Are you sure that only one person called the cell phone of Natalee Holloway trying to get up with her after they saw her leave from the bar with the three men? That is hard to believe. But maybe they did not know what her cell phone number was. But at lest the one that did know her number tried to call her. Wonder who that was? Maybe one of her best friends circle?

That Ruben Trapenaburg is one snappy dresser. I bet he's "rolled" once or twice in those Aruban raves.

Posted by: bamaguy11 | July 7, 2005 03:36 AM

===
LOLOL!!
=I thought Mariaine Croes was a babe in the last days of her reign! Noticed how she began changing her wardrobe?

@harry
I made the troll list 2 weeks ago when I disagreed with IH.

IHOP

did you see how they go after Dan full throttle

i still love that one day when that gal posted that he was gossiping and spreading rumors!!

goodnight

i am very tired

That was pretty funny

Goodnight to all.
God bless and God bless our COUNTRY
Our President
Our TROOPS ALL OVER THE WORLD
and God Bless Natalee & her mother
Beth and family and friends.

Con Ment:

You deserve a seat of honor in our troll sanctuary. Bravo!!

Dutch dictionary

Hopper.... a gay swinger

Yea I think I am about to hit the hay myself. It's so nice and quiet tonight. The other half is out of town. No kids running around, the critters are even settled down.

Joj

Mariaine Croes was an enigma. At first glimpse, I thought she looked 15 years old. However, I must admit, she morphed into a babe. The tight jeans, the short skirt,....she must have hired a stylist. lol

lol -
--
Latest rumour from Aruba shown on Dutch TV:
One of Natalee's best friends stated that the night before she disappeared, they went swimming while being drunk and having used coke. They were hardly able to reach the shore. Perhaps the next night she didn't reach the shore at all?

Posted by: Sceptic | July 7, 2005 03:40 AM

- Huh??
--
Dompig & Croes cannot talk, because they muffed the "something bad happened" statement and allowed a torrent of media frenzy. Now, only the PM amd MOJ can release information.

Posted by: harry | July 7, 2005 03:47 AM

- Bingo! Well put. Noticed how the Prosecutor is now making press statements herself? They are accountable to someone..

SOUNDS LIKE A GREAT PLAN. I GOT THE INFO ALSO ABOUT THAT. THANKS....!!

! and bama and IHOP etc

i told dan that i would chip in to help him set up a forum for us so that we could post privately.

i told him to sign up for pay pal so that i could help.

i know that it is not expensive to run a forum, i just don't have the time, but would be happy to help the only way i can

CHARGE IT!! LOL!!

i think there are some wonderful ppl here, just too many dam trolls!!

Posted by: MrsJimiHendrix | July 7, 2005 03:47 AM

http://www.cdnn.info/news/travel/t050618.html

It seems the Aruba police wasnt even on to the 3 now 1 in question.

It took the family to find them and did this in the first 24 hours of Natalee being reported missing.

Are the family better investigators than the Aruba Police?

The Aruba Police donest want this solved so as not to"do this to the best frined's son."

I suppose the demonstrators, put together by the government, government employees day off, probably are being dictated what to do.

I have an idea it was that creep on with Greta who set it up and some of them probably could not read the signs they were carrying.

If this gets too hot, government officials have to work harder and it cuts into their rave party time and deals on the side.

On O Reilly Factor Greta spoke to Satish
They didnt talk about the case ( well sorta kinda maybe)

Greta said that Satish said he and JVDS arent
friends any longer.

Geta ask why>

Satish said JVDS changed his story 14 times and tried to implicate him(them)

Greta said how do you know this, the police could have been making this up.

Satish said police showed him on paper where he changed the story.

I have wondered if the people holding the signs actually know what is happening and why its happening and not what the goverment have them to know?

When one only gets on side of the story, one gets a skewered view.

Just like keeping the court and/or evidence silent where none of anything is for public viewing.

Transparent goverment and court proceedings.

As well as more than one judge deciding the guilt or innocence of those accused.

The ones not "well connected, rich or of the of the right ethnicity is SOL( sh!t out of Luck)

Lisa Pinto, "But first, let`s go to CNN correspondent Dave Mattingly"

DAVID MATTINGLY, CNN CORRESPONDENT: "Well, earlier tonight, just a couple of hours ago, some
new information coming to us in this case. Defense attorneys for the Kalpoe brothers confirmed to CNN that fishermen - - Aruban fishermen have told investigators that they did not see a couple matching the description of Natalee Holloway and Joran Van Der Sloot on the beach the night that Natalee was reported missing.
What they did see, however, was a
WHITE Suzuki on the beach.
If you remember, a WHITE Suzuki
was one of the vehicles confiscated during a search of the Van Der Sloot home.
This new information
might have been responsible in part for the judge`s decision to keep Van Der Sloot in jail for another 60 days for questioning in this case. We don`t know if it had any bearing on his decision to release the Kalpoe brothers."
- -
Can anyone confirm this?

I finally get to sleep and tropical storm rolls in and wakes everybody up!! JoJo that Suzuki was NOT one of the cars sent to Holland to be stripped of all eveidence, er, tested for forensics and do not think the Sloots had one like that. Believe the reporter got that wrong but he was able to confirm no one one beach that night per the fishermen.

Sort of messes up the 3 amigos story as well as the ones who keep posting here about the MN kids being on the beach swimming while wasted.

If NH had drowned, the currents would have brought the body back in as has been tested and verified by local experts in the tides and currents like elderly fishermen. Search team also has a drog weighted just like NH body they use to test. It went back into the cave beheath the rocks l50 feet and now thanks to these three sociopaths, some diver will have to risk his life going back in there to look.

So not sure where the white suzuki came from but earlier there was discussion about it maybe on last forum.

So second piece of evidence from today is Satish saying Joran has told 14 different stories and signed all of them. No wonder he is smirking.

Maybe Papa Sloot gave the no body no case corpse to one of his many friends for disposal and that is why heaclled the kiddies in Monday afternoon before he should have even known she was missing and told them no body. Since his speciality was making evidence disappear, it would seem everybody owes him big time and that is how he is able to keep this suppressed.

The list of those who knew she was not back safely home is staggering. When they started lecturing on how we MUST respect their system and culture before anybody had even thought otherwise is when we should have known. One cannot force oneself to respect something. Show respect maybe but not feel it. This system is just perfect for this type of massive criminal operation because of the total secrecy and the fact that evidence can be destoryed without the public ever seeing or knowing about it as Eduardo Mathews claims was done to him. No wonder they love it so!

Wow, torrential downpour here but must try to sleep anyway.

Police were seen moving two vehicles from the Van Der Sloot home last month, including a white Suzuki.

"That is the only thing that they saw that was abnormal for that day," the lawyer said.

Police were seen moving two vehicles from the Van Der Sloot home last month, including a white Suzuki.

On Sunday, police took each of the three suspects separately to a stretch of beach near the Marriott "to make sure their stories matched," government spokesman Ruben Trapenberg said. (Full story)

Three Dutch F-16 jets equipped with lasers and special cameras made a test flight over Aruba in preparation for a search Wednesday. The planes landed Monday on the adjacent island of Curacao. (Full story)

Each of the F-16s is equipped with a television infrared camera, two daylight cameras and a 12-inch lens housed in pods slung beneath the aircraft.

About 40 personnel accompanied the planes; they include specialists who will analyze pictures taken from the planes, the ministry said.

The test flight was aimed at helping the pilots and crews familiarize themselves with locations to be searched. The jets flew over the island's landmark lighthouse, on its northern tip.

A security guard arrested earlier in the case and then freed told CNN that Deepak Kalpoe confided in him when they were both in jail that the group went to the lighthouse after leaving the nightclub with Holloway.

Holloway, from Mountain Brook, Alabama, a Birmingham suburb, was celebrating her high school graduation with classmates and parent chaperones when she disappeared.

CNN's Tracy Sabo and Patrick Oppmann contributed to the repor

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Just popped in to the FBI's missing person database after reading one of Dan Riehl's postings: Natalee Holloway isn't listed as a missing person. Couln't find her as kidnapped either. In fact, no Natalee Holloway on the site. Wonder if one of the agents in Aruba 'updated' it?

http://www.angelsmissing.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=1541&st=30

go to this site and read how Prosecution was about to railroad the 2 black guys...

despicable and disgusting

How can anyone Believe Karin Janssen is working the best interest of the Twitty/Holloway family, when Janssen wants to pen this on innocent people.


Janssen is the one who went into the 2 black men home like "cowboys' but couldnt and didnt go in to the VDS home like "cowboys"

I dont trust her....

Well I dont trust Aruba goverment

I dont trust the Netherlands

Something stinks and it isnt the skunk.

usually just a lurker, but saw a typo/mis-copy+paste so thought i'd clarify your post, seedyrum. :)

FROM CNN ARTICLE: http://www.cnn.com/2005/LAW/07/05/aruba.missing/index.html%20%5D%5D%3E

David Kock, Satish Kalpoe's attorney, told CNN that two fishermen told investigators they didn't see a couple matching the descriptions of Holloway and Van Der Sloot at the beach the night she disappeared.

But the lawyer quoted the couple as saying they did see a white Suzuki vehicle on the beach.

"That is the only thing that they saw that was abnormal for that day," the lawyer said.

Police were seen moving two vehicles from the Van Der Sloot home last month, including a white Suzuki.

With the secrecy of evidence and investigating, noone knows if the Police doing anything or if the Prosecution is doing anything.

The Prosecution "could have evidence and flushing down the toilet, burning, contaminating, manufacturing evidence( not against JVDS but for PVDS)

Anything done insecrecy and cant be spoken about leave a nasty taste in my mouth, and its not the coffee I am drinking.

Well, that's pretty interesting that she is not on the list, but do you think the reason she is not on the list is because they suspect she is dead, or they know it but what? Why can the FBI not say it? This is so f*igging puzzling. Is that why the FBI say their hands were tied, that they know and cannot tell because they are operating in a soverign country?

Shelby has asked for Navy Seals to go in and try to find her, but I think he probably has an alterior motive to that as well. Seals are good at gathering information.

Pray for the one captured in that hell hole!

proud-
I think that once you push aside theories, gossip and hype, the truth may be simple: they have a body and a confession; they are marely trying to put together what happened that night to get a better idea of what actually happened and who was involved. This will also help improve the confidence in their Aruban citizens that thier polis dept has everything under control. Everything else, like the Equusearch folks, the F-16's, the 100 or so Marines, all of those things we not really requested by the local Law Enforcement but instead were provided by their goverment to satisfy bothe the Dutch and the Americans. I'm passing out here...

I am so mad, just sleeping nicely and this tropical storm cindy wakes up dogs and now they are acting up so badly.

Proud, since they have asked for divers maybe we should put a carrier right off shore, lol! The FBI website says it is for things within their jurisdiction as Arua tells us every five minutes, this is not. Still believe I have seen them list people outside the country. Maybe a thirty day waiting period which hs just expired and they are slow to post. I do not read too much into her not being posted on thie list just yet for she could still appear there.

So another piece of information was from Satish that he saw fourteen diffferent statements Joran had signed. No wonder he smirks. After this is over, I think it would be rather fitting if it is known for a fact he was involved, his bragging or some way to know for sure an teh same thing happen to him as whatever has to Nat.

No wonder they started with the lectures about respecting this system before anybody even thourght of not doing so. As seedy says, it is perfect for them for they can make any amount of eviidence just disappear. That is what Paulus did for Ben King supposedly. All covering for and repaying favors.

Will try again for sleep. G'night II

BETH HOLLOWAY TWITTY OWES NO ONE ANY APOLOGY
and for the Kalpoe Bro..to even suggest a lawsuit
I say HAHAHAHA what scum...

I have not heard anyone apologize to Beth Twitty
that she is in the middle of a living hell
because her daughter had been missing for almost 40 days... and their is NO EVIDENCE AND NO BODY
and that the 3 prime suspects WERE ALLOWED TO RUN LOOSE ON THE STREETS OF ARUBA for ten before being arrested for the crime..after THeY LIED TO AUTHORITES...

WHERE ARE ALL THE APOLOGIZES owed to Beth and her family?

And will any of these apologizes even begin to give restitution for the life of NATALEE..

WHAT A SICK and I mean S I C K world we live in.
SICCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCK

Posted by: The Truth | July 7, 2005 05:16 AM

No body, no case works both ways. Wonder if old Pap Sloots has ever thought about that door swinging both ways?

They never think anyting applies right back at themselves.

But if something happened to him and his devil spawn and no one could find the bodies, it would be Anita insted of Beth begging for her child back.

I just hope there is a resolution soon.
G'nite.

I noticed that the Groene kids were still up on the FBI's website, as is Amy Bradley, so it looks like it's been updated, thought not since Shasta Groene was found. Her brother Dylan is still there though so I believe that Natalee's photo may have been removed. This page doesn't differentiate between international or national victims - all are american citizens though.
- I suspect a big snow job in Aruba. -

Notice:

To all concerned parties posting here.

Please consider writing Richard Shelby, Senator from Alabama an email requesting that he
form immediately a counsel to investigate, research, advise, implement political action in the case of Natalee Holloway..

I have already sent my email to him with this request and hope you all will do the same..
Could serve as a powerful tool in this battle.

Please include your name and address on your email..and if you are a registered Alabama Voter please make mention of that too...thank you...

senator@shelby.senate.gov

BREAKING NEWS...
HAVE ANY OF YOU TUNED IN TO FOX, CNN, OR SOME OTHER NETWORKS THIS MORNING. LONDON HAS BEEN ATTACKED BY TERRORIST. 8 SEPARATE ATTACKS SO FAR. ANOTHER ONE JUST HAPPENED.
No deaths have been confirmed yet.

Watching it now.

Jojo, that is what I am really thinking, that the FBI knows it and they cannot intervene, because it is a soverign country.

I think Joran led them to the body that night that he made the "murder statement." I think that was when I began to see Beth start changing somewhat from optimism about getting Beth home alive, to getting Beth back to Alabama.

Tonight, I think it was Scarborough or maybe Dan Abrams who asked her about her optimism, and she seemed to be going really good to that point, but then she almost broke. I don't recall her answer, but it was not an optimistic sounding statement, i.e., she wanted Natalee back so she could go to college, etc.

Wonder if it is al Qaeda or eco-terrorists. Could be working in concert secondary to the G8 meets in Scotland, just a few miles away.

They are now reporting 9 explosions, 6 on the tube and 3 on buses, all info is just coming in. CNN, FOX are live.

Hi everyone this is Detective Hardy. Here is my second draft.....

When I last sent my first draft and suggested that you take the three suspects out I said do it during the SAME time that Natalee went missing. Instead you failed to follow my instructions and took them out during the day.

Well, I have some more instructions for you and I hope you pay closer attention this time. I am not going to ask the Aruba detectives to carry out these tasks, instead I will ask Ms. Greta van Susteren.

Ms. Greta van Susteren. Please help us all out. I know you’ve been trying your best and now I want you to try even harder.

1. I would like you to please set up an interview with three people. I want all three of them in the interview at the same time. You can use video links, phones or whatever, just as long as they are all together. You need about one hour and you need to get things straight.
The three people are Jody Bearman, Beth Holloway Twitty and Charles Croes. (Of course other relevant participants are welcomed as well.)
I would like you to go step-by-step through the events that took place from the time Beth Holloway Twitty arrived in Aruba on May 30th, until about 0800 on May 31st.
Please have this group describe exactly what happened as best they can. Please concentrate on how they came to the name "Joran van der Sloot", and everything that was said upon meeting the van der Sloots in each instance "the group" arrived at their home. Please describe the layout of the van der Sloot house and garden - with a graphic floor plan of the house and its surrounding area and streets. Please show where each person and vehicle was located during the first meeting with the Paulus van der Sloot and how they changed positions, and also do the same for the later meeting that followed with Paulus his son Joran and Deepak Kalpoe.

2. Greta, please do a report about the location on the beach where Joran claims to have left Natalee. Go to that location and show me the area. Try to show me the point Joran claims to have left Natalee. Show me the surrounding area, pan to the road, take me to the access points, show me the points of access from across the road, give me long shots, med, cu, etc…Let’s take a good look at this place. Please ask authorities how the search in that area was conducted. Can you please have someone draw a line on a map, which extends from the point where Joran claims to have left her 2000 feet off the coast into the sea? Then create a grid of 3 x 3 foot squares that extend from the coastline out into the water all along that coast for 4000 feet. Did scuba divers search each and every 3 X 3 box? When? Did they look under every bit of sea grass? How much of a search was done in those waters and when did it happen?

Then to emphasize the importance of understanding why we were left to ignore those waters for so long I ask you to do something a bit unusual….


3. (This is not a joke, and in no way do I associate Natalee with the animal. This is science.) Please Greta I want you to find a veterinarian who is willing to anesthetize a pig. Then I want you to buy a pig – about a 120lb pig. (Hell I’ll buy it) You will need permission from the Aruban government for this, - we don’t want people to get sick or injured. I want you to clean that animal with soap, like Johnson Baby Shampoo – give it a good bath and rinse it down. Then dress the pig in some clothing and take the animal to the site where Joran claims to have left the Natalee. Take the pig there about 0200 on an evening when the waters are similar to how they were on May 30th 2005. Say a prayer, and then have the doctor "put the pig to sleep". Get some tall guy to drag that pig out as far as he can into the water and let it go. Then wait for sunrise.
The next day track its movement and tell me what you find. Let it go now, don’t touch it. Just watch it as long as you can, and let me know what happens.

Thank you
Hardy

They are saying two things
The announcement of London winning the olympic bid
and the G 8 meeting as well.

Scary that if that were the truth, this whole 'cover-up' was to keep the powerful media at bay. But it would also bring closure to all this mess.

Sorry..
hardy and tiny..
watching the breaking news about the explosions
in London on tv .

Wonder if it is al Qaeda or eco-terrorists. Could be working in concert secondary to the G8 meets in Scotland, just a few miles away.

Posted by: proudredneck | July 7, 2005 05:55 AM

-
Eco-terrorists

90 CASUALTIES SO FAR. DO NOT KNOW IF THEY ARE DEAD OR INJURED.

Have you ever watched the "rent-a-demonstrator" group? No matter what it is they don't like, whatever political convention, economic summit, etc., you see the same people there again and again.

I wonder how well they are paid to do that. I guess the ones with the bombs make better than the ones with the signs.

Hardy,
Give us a break man!

Buy a plane ticket on priceline and go out there yourself. Good luck getting to the places you mentioned; they're blocked off! Also, got to fox news.com and leave greta an e-mail; I just did.
-
I also found a Yahoo profile on Natalie Holloway the day after she became missing. Went back to it a few days later and it was taken down.

"rent-a-demonstrator" group
never heard of it.
Reminds me of 'rent-a-jury'...

http://www.cdnn.info/news/travel/t050618.html


go and read there.

good thing the family had their own private detective when they landed in Aruba.

Or they wouldnt have any evidence certainly none the Aruba Poloce gathered.

I hope BTH didnt show all her evidence to Karin Jannsen( I dont trust her to be an advocate for Natalee)


Hold your friends close but hold you enemies closer.

You know what just occurred to me: The NOW group. Wonder if they have contacted Natalee's family to make a statement on the abuse of women. :)

http://www.cdnn.info/news/travel/t050618.html

I wonder if that's the information that they had threatened to tell.

Hardy,
Give us a break man!

Buy a plane ticket on priceline and go out there yourself. Good luck getting to the places you mentioned; they're blocked off! Also, got to fox news.com and leave greta an e-mail; I just did.
-
I also found a Yahoo profile on Natalie Holloway the day after she became missing. Went back to it a few days later and it was taken down.

Posted by: Jojo | July 7, 2005 06:09 AM

If those places are blocked off then why did I see people walking on the beach while Joran was being led to an area on the beach? Blocked off? How did they know the exact location?

http://www.cdnn.info/news/travel/t050618.html

I wonder if that's the information that they had threatened to tell.

Posted by: just_a_lurker | July 7, 2005 06:19 AM
-------------------------------

dated 18 june

The information they have is not something public on the internet.

Sorry, didn't see the date. That's the first I've heard of that though.

Whoa, al Qaeda has really set off the cowboys now. The Brits won't willy nilly with terrorists. They are very good at this kind of thing.

Wonder where our al Qaeda members are this morning. Not many of them posting. I guess they are watching to see what their fellow terrorists are doing.

Dan, get us up a London/Terror blog.

JERUSALEM (AP) Senior Israeli official says Scotland Yard told Israel minutes before explosions it had received warnings of possible terror attacks.

Hardy,

That is pretty specific...hopefully Greta listen and try it.

Send it to her serval times until she either acknowlege you or there is some sliver of word on tv ir Dan repots that your suggestion is taken under advisement

Sorry, didn't see the date. That's the first I've heard of that though.

Posted by: just_a_lurker | July 7, 2005 06:39 AM
--------------------------------

yeah , me too, wonder how much more is out there. I just got that too, and all this time I was going on the Charles Croes interview information. Who knows what is true anymore?

Hardy

they may want to try with the pig in a container ie barrel or suitcase

as well as without a container

"Who knows what is true anymore?"

That's for sure. I hope we all find out someday what really happened.

BTW: That's a great letter to Greta.

Well by Greta's report last night on O'Reilly, JVDS is blaming "it" on the Kalpoe's Brothers. They no longer consider him their friend.

Imagine that

I do believe ole Joren is going to crack soon- let's all keep the faith- a reliable news source stated Deepak as saying he has seen 14 different signed statements Joren has given to the polis and some of which he was trying to place blame onf Natalee's disappearance on the Kalpoe's- so if all are innocent why would anyone find the need to "place any blame"?

And with 14 different statements young vds is going to have a hard time keeping any of his stories straight at this time- he is going to slip up soon and break down- everyone hold tight, keep focused, keep the belief that this will have a successful end!

The radio here is saying the blasts in London are from power surges. ???

Well, the Holloway saga has been blown off the airwaves by the London terrorism attack, which happened about 3 hours ago.

What bothers me about the whole thing as far as Joran "cracking," is that he has been told he does not have to. Papa has already informed him that there is no body, there is no crime.

He seems so cavalier about the whole thing, when I see him grinning and wearing sunglasses, like he thinks he is some kind of rock star.

Can anyone confirm this post?


Guest

Joined: 01 October 2003
Online Status: Online
Posts: 75 Posted: 15 June 2005 at 1:09am | IP Logged

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Fox news www.foxnews.com does not look good...

They found torn polka dot panties and 3 condoms and duct tape on a tree in an area by a Hotel beach area. I believe they said the location tip was obtained from on of the held suspects, through one of the released suspects while in jail.

Looks pretty damning to me.

I know our FBI will do its job to ensure the condom DNA is potected and processed carefully.

God bless Natailie's heart and soul - If this is what it seems ,we are all sorry we were there not there to defend this poor girl from this horrifying act of the beast / devil.

We must work hard find / recover her and return her to her family.

May God watch over the Holloway's, and help them though this difficult time.

Does anyone know how to contribute to the reward fund ?

Jim - Iowa

"They found torn polka dot panties . . ."

Yeah, like Natalee would have been wearing those huge granny panties. Girls like Natalee wear THONGS -- especially when they are on vacation in Aruba!

Gab: There was once a place on the main page here that Dan had put up. You might try that again. That was how I found it. I know there costs have to be phenomenal for staying over there: They have to eat, they have to rent a car, they have to have petro, they have to pay the room & board as the Holiday Inn only let them stay for a few days without charging, plus all the air fares back and forth from USA to Aruba, and then their fare is still due in Birmingham. I am sure anything you would contribute would be most appreciated.

Prayers are important too.

I just woke up, and it occurred to me that Greta van Susteren needs to interview Senator Richard Shelby and Secretary of State Condoleeza Rice QUICK! I know that Fox News isn't received on the island of Aruba, but those interviews would be available in print by Associated Press, or to viewers with satellite dishes, and that might get the Committe on Anti-Incorrect Thinking to realize that they have more than just a PR problem, to be smoothed over by silver toungued Ruben Trapenberg.

okay, did some checking that post may be referring back to 3 weeks ago or so but wonder if there was any DNA testing/results or were this items "planted" there as a way to send the polis on yet another wild goose chase.

Polka dot granny pnties well after seeing AVDS in that black see-thru top with a white bra on maybe the granny panties belong to her!

Gab, I loved the polka dot panties quote. I remember working in an office once where a girl wore stars and striped panties under tight white pants and, when she walked down the hall, we all stood up and saluted.

Professor, I am not sure that would be possible right now with Condi Rice. Seems like this terrorist attack in London is going to be all-consuming for her.

But, I think Senator Shelby would be willing to be interviewed by Greta. He is always amenable to helping out. He is a good senator, but then so is Jeff Sessions, but Richard Shelby serves on the important committees for this kind of thing and he has "clout" secondary to tenure.

Gab. I thought after seeing those panties that Joran might be a cross-dresser. *g*.

Proudredneck, do you have an email address for Jeff Sessions that works? His regular senate page does not allow the email to go through.

oh, what creative minds we all have~ LOL

Continued thoughts and prayers for the Holloway/Twitty family that answers will be there for them and that they can bring their daughter back home soon.

What bothers me about the whole thing as far as Joran "cracking," is that he has been told he does not have to. Papa has already informed him that there is no body, there is no crime.

He seems so cavalier about the whole thing, when I see him grinning and wearing sunglasses, like he thinks he is some kind of rock star.
------------

Worse yet, the judge ruled that he cannot be questioned now without his attorney present. This hasn't received a lot of attention, but it is huge: it means that nothing useful is going to come out of this mouth in the next 60 days.

Hardy

they may want to try with the pig in a container ie barrel or suitcase

as well as without a container

Posted by: seedyrum | July 7, 2005 07:02 AM
---------------------------------------
That requires a lot of coordination- I mean on the night of her disappearance. I'm trying to stay simple. Let's say Joran tried to get rid of her fast, no conspiracies, no plans, just a dumb kid making a dumb mistake. Or maybe Natale is freakin out on drugs and drowns herself. So what happens? How long does it float? Then sink - then float again? In that water, off that beach, in those conditions.

I saw some guy on a TV explaining the movement off the water on a desolate side of the island where the surf was rough. He place a piece of grass in some rough and showed how quickly it moved off. So what? Have you seen pictures of the beach at the Marriot. It's like a swimming pool.

If Joran sold the girl or was involved in some elaborate plot then we would have to except that ALL the lies were planned. We can't just stop at one lie. We would have to believe that when Paulus said "no body no crime", that was also planned. That when the group came back tot he house and Deepak was there that also planned!

Some people like to say it was ALL planned but then stop "The Plan" where they like. That is a sign that they are frustrated with the lack of evidence and want a simple solution.
Oh yeah, he took her to the side of the island and handed her to sex slavery then came back said he dropped her at the Holiday Inn and then changed the story to we dropped her at the beach! Well, that was all planned! And then he knew that Beth would arrive back with the police so he had Deepak wait with him! That was planned! The father said "no body no corpse " an then Deepak told that to Mickey in jail. That was planned!
Yeah! It was all planned!
Come on! Wake up! 90% for sure Joran left her for dead! No plan!

Van der Sloot's mother has said her son told her he was alone with Holloway on a beach but he did not harm her.

Under Dutch law that governs Aruba, a protectorate of the Netherlands, detainees may be held 116 days before being charged by a judge. The standard of evidence required for further detention increases with each court hearing.

Joe Scarborough needs to get more involved in this story. This isn't just a Fox News Exclusive, much as I like Fox News. Actually, I like Joe's coverage better, because he tells it like it is. But then again, Joe will never get an interview on the island of Aruba. He'd probably turn up missing, and his body would never be recovered. So, maybe Joe, with his congressional contacts, can do some interviews in the House and Senate, among the Alabama and Mississippi delegations, and with any other Senator or Congressman who wants to weigh in on this topic. According to reports, ALL of our legislators are being flooded with mail about the Natalee Holloway Outrage.

Just for fun: Let's fly a Judge in from the US this time! That should take care of the matter nicely.

As far as Satish's lawyer threatening BH? Criminals always try to take the focus off of themselves, don't they?

Aruba, so far I have learned the following about your system of justice:

1. It is illegal for the victim's family to public annouce facts or circumstances about the case .
2. Possible suspects can lie and put others at risk and it is not criminal.
3. No body no case.
4. Suspects which create the most suspicion have a 10 day grace period before they are
brought into custody.
5. Suspects of a certain background are detained immediately without any more evidence
than "wore black clothing and had black skin"
6. The judge secretly decides all issues of evidence.
7. Lying is a tool in the legal process for which there is no punishment.
8. Bearing false witness against thy neighbor is scratched from the commandments--

I am sure the bloggers out there can add more---


My patience has been lost---I am joining the boycott---we need to unite.

Roger, Rijer--- at el -- the line is drawn.

rons

Another idea that occurred to me as I was falling asleep last night was for everyone in this forum to call one or two travel agencies in their home town and make sure they're brought up to date on recent developments in Aruba. It wouldn't take much time, and the travel agents would be all ears, because it's their business to know these things. Perhaps they've been too busy to keep up with the news, and perhaps they've been to busy to visit the online forums.

professor/anyone --

I've twice witten to Shelby and Sessoms. But: Can someone suggest a good, short list of folks whom I can pester with daily correspondance? I want to feel like I am doing something to help, but I want to direct these efforts in the right direction.

Thanks.

Professor, go here. This page has an e-mail thing for his office. I have used this one before and gotten responses.
http://sessions.senate.gov/contact.htm#form

When you call the travel agents, let them know that you have kept up to date on ALL developments out of Aruba, and be sure to ask them if they have any questions THEY would like to ask about Aruba. Try to answer those questions as factually and objectively as possible; and leave your number, in case the travel agent thinks of any other questions he or she would like to ask.

The minute Joran said that he left her at the Holiday Inn they should have searched the grounds, building and waters.

Oh but actually we left her at the beach!

The beach! But you've had access to that area all this time! Did you ever go back to check where you left her after you heard she was missing? When? Did you go back?
Why did you not direct us to that area when we asked you? You can't NOT do that! That's paramount to causing her disappearance!

Criminals always try to take the focus off of themselves, don't they?
------------

And countries that know they are responsible and have done a crappy job but don't like being called on it.

Joe Scarbrough is really good at hard-hitting situations. Professor, he is a law grad of UA. Hey! It's a great law school. War Eagle!

I believe I heard Joe last night say he had been talking to "friends" in Washington (now, who would that be?) and they were all very confused about the Aruba situation, like the rest of us.

I emailed Hillary. She is going down there to lecture the Holloways on the importance of having the rest of the world like us.

Speaking of Hillary - I wonder how things would be working out if it were Chelsea that were missing instead of Natalee?
Any idea what the next steps are with all of the appeals being filed?

Why doesn't Joran drive a car? How old do you have to be to drive in Aruba?

"The people in Aruba have been overwhelming supportive of our entire family since Natalie's disappearance. When I arrived on the Island two days after she was reported missing, I was always greeted with expressions of concern and hope for Natalie's return. There are hundreds if not thousands of stories of people coming together and helping each other during this incident. Bernadett from Economy Car Rental, the people at Holiday Inn, the Aruban Government Workers who left work to search the island are just a few of the examples. This is the good story of Aruba . The compassion and desire to help has meant more than you can imagine to our family.

Unfortunately, there are a very small number of individuals that are holding the people of Aruba , the Holloway family and what seems like the whole world hostage. These individuals are not a reflection of the Aruban people or the system of Justice in Aruba . These individuals know what happened and are refusing to accept responsibility for their actions. It also appears that certain individuals may be attempting to protect those individuals that know what happened. Helping them hide from their responsibility will destroy rather than preserve what is left of their lives, hopes and dreams. "

This was written by the uncle of Natalee Holloway. We are victims here too, we also demand justice as much as anyone else on this board. I am very upset and disapponted at the developments taking place here and I feel I can speak for any other Arubian when I say that it's very hurtful to see Americans get so worked up and threaten boycott because of the same people we dislike. Will you sacrifice a whole population because of a handfull of people?

Thank you proudredneck, it worked like a charm.

Hardy, you have to be 18 to drive a car.

Dissappointed Arubian, I feel your pain. When I am upset with my gov't I write letters - have you done that? I make my voice heard. Have you done that? What we are hearing is not good. It seems that Aruba has turned on a family in distress. I love your island, but would not feel safe there knowing what is happening now.

I certainly will not think I will be making plans to go to Aruba. This is a scary place! I know bad things can happen anywhere but in the view of recent events, it has become clear if you complain about it, you are attacked.

Beth Holloway is now being accused of lying, by calling the Kalpoe brothers criminals (probably a poor choice of words). It was ok for the Kalpoe brothers to lie but not Beth. If this continues she should charge them for what they said about her daughter.

Americans need information on what our rights are when traveling out of our country, it’s hard enough finding out about them here.

Peace

Disappointed Arubian: YES

one person is missing and now aruba is an unsafe island full of criminals ?? Come on guys, you can't blame the whole country, how long have they being hosting tourist ? One person in a million ??

I posted links awhile back, but we really should set up a page somewhere and fill it with email and snail mail address' and web links.

I would call, snail mail and email the following each week:

1)The US President and Vice President.

2)The Ambassador to the Netherlands. The Holloway requested we send letters to the Dutch Ambassador in Wash, DC (Royal Netherlands Embassy, 4200 Linnean Ave, NW Washington, DC, 20008. See "letter writing campaign" post on this site or Scared Monkeys. I sent 10 letters, one from each member of my immeadiate family.

3)The Netherlands and Aruban govenments.

4)All of your government representatives in your area, even the state reps. Ask your state reps to contact the federal govt.

5)The State Dept and Sec of State.

6) The FBI office in your area and in Wash DC.

7) Each of the major news medias, CNN, CNBC, Fox, etc. Indicate that you want the coverage to continue.

Be respectful, but indicate that justice must be served and Natalee must be found.

icey

(I've twice witten to Shelby and Sessoms. But:

Can someone suggest a good, short list of folks whom I can pester with daily correspondance? I want to feel like I am doing something to help, but I want to direct these efforts in the right direction. )


Dissappointed Arubian, I'm afraid that you will be even more disappointed, if this investigation goes the way it appears to be going.

You need to remember that the American people suffered a terrible blow on 9/11. Many things changed on that date. Americans came together with a new resolve to protect our fellow citizens, be they of Dutch, Arubian, or Mexican origin. The government of Aruba still hasn't figured it out. Americans will be relentless in seeking an accounting for every American citizen who disappears overseas. We cannot afford to be soft on this issue.

Recent demonstrations on the island of Aruba tell me that the Aruban people haven't figured it out either. They think this whole matter will just blow over. They are mistaken.

They tell us that WE must understand THEIR system of justice (or non-justice), and that we OWE THEM the benefit of the doubt. We DO NOT owe them anything of the sort. Rather THEY OWE US some reasonable assurances that the criminals (May I use that word?) who are responsible for the disappearance are brought to justice. And THEY OWE US a full accounting of what happend to Natalee. Nothing less is acceptable.

i think we all want to find natalie and bring whoever did whatever to her to justice, but we must understand that all of this took place in a different country and although we may not like their rules or ways of doing things we have no juristriction over their country. When you travel to other countries you put yourself at risk of their judicial system.

ss: yes we can

ss - Do you not see the people of Aruba demonstrating against Americans? Do you really think that is a safe travel environment to be in? I don't and I won't return until I deem it to be a safe and American friendly place to go.

I sure wouldn't send my daughter to Aruba - based alone on the way this case has been handled. Perception is reality - write it down!

ss: who has juristriction in Iraq, your owner need's to let you out more often

Latest rumour from Aruba shown on Dutch TV:
One of Natalee's best friends stated that the night before she disappeared, they went swimming while being drunk and having used coke. They were hardly able to reach the shore. Perhaps the next night she didn't reach the shore at all?

Posted by: Sceptic | July 7, 2005 03:40 AM

Okay, well good question. What would happen?
It seems like a lot of people assume she would just drift out to the sea. I disagree. Look at that water there. That is a very calm protected area. Anything in that area is going to wash back to shore. It has two very distinct zones.
There's some kind of reef or drop off and it's VERY far out.
Look at this pic in front of the Holiday Inn where Natalee stayed. Where is the body going? Do you see the drop off way out there? That's where you would have to take her to get rid of her for good. A corpse in the protected area would float around for awhile and come back to shore.
http://www.tripadvisor.com/Images-g147249-d184828-b1061851S-Hotel_ocaen_view-Holiday_Inn_Sunspree_Resort-Palm_Eagle_Beach_Aruba.jpg

She swam all the way out there? No way!

Today is a bad day for BT. She has tried to keep NH disappearance in the headlines and Fox has been all over it. Today, the headlines will be London. I doubt very seriously theres any reports today on NH. The reporters there can lay by the pool and relax, Greta can go buy a bathing suit, Geraldo can visit Alhambra and gamble the day away ( or he might be jetting on over to London to get in the middle of things there), and,for the first time in a month I can skip Bill O'Reilly tonight.

SS: Be careful how you use those words, WE MUST UNDERSTAND. Yes, we should avoid traveling to countries like Aruba, where a corrupt justice system allows sociopaths to prey on American tourists and then cover their tracks in broad daylight. But we have every right, once we've booked a trip there, to believe that what is written in the travel brochure is accurate.

Today is a bad day for BT. She has tried to keep NH disappearance in the headlines and Fox has been all over it. Today, the headlines will be London. I doubt very seriously theres any reports today on NH. The reporters there can lay by the pool and relax, Greta can go buy a bathing suit, Geraldo can visit Alhambra and gamble the day away ( or he might be jetting on over to London to get in the middle of things there), and,for the first time in a month I can skip Bill O'Reilly tonight.

funny thing eyeforaneye... when the US holds foreign citizens in jail or prosecutes them i don't hear their countries running over here with their media telling us how to run investigations

Disappointed Aruban --

I understand your position. For what it is worth, my distrust is toward the Dutch. I've always felt that an Aruban Police Chief, an Aruban Prosecutor, an Aruban controlled legal entity would have gotten this right from the start.

But the Holloway's have been through hell. They don't deserve any more grief. They are good people whose hearts are broken; worse yet, they are in limbo and can't really begin the grieving process.

This backlash directed in the direction of the Holloways, in particular, and Americans, in general, is not appropriate.

I would be largely satisfied if some official said, "Hey, we screwed this up early, but we are trying to get it right now."

I could respect this and at least feel better about what is being done now; however, this penchant for trashing the victim and taking the offended country's inventory is most distrubing.


ss: it is funny

yes professor you are right.. but how many people do you know that go to Mexico ? They too have a corrupt government. I certainly think this has made a lot of people think about where they should and should not travel.

I got a question for the Dutch - do your courts ever convict anybody of anything? How about the pedophile ring that was broken up in Holland in the recent past? Are all those people out on the streets now? Are they now working at day care centers? Do the Dutch people even care?

And, by the way, Al Qaeda doesn't like the Dutch either - it is only matter of time before you get hit.

Yes, SS, there are a lot of corrupt countries, but NONE, with the possible exception of Saudi Arabia, are more friendly to their local sociopaths.

come on that wasn't necessary... you shouldn't wish them fanatics upon anyone...

Does anyone know if Natalee's friends actually said that they were doing coke the night before she dissappeared. In all of the interviews that I watched with her friends, they said that she was drinking responsibly and that she would never do drugs. They really need to tell the truth instead of sugarcoating it. It could lead to solving the case.

Hardy, you have to be 18 to drive a car.

Posted by: Yolande | July 7, 2005 09:04 AM
========================================
How does it work? Can a 17 year-old drive during certain hours as they are learning?

This kid Joran always needs "a ride". In a sense it becomes an excuse. He always needs a ride. There's something in that, in the way things are done. People involved see Joran as always needing a ride.

But then the story with the beach drop-off has him walking home. The Kalpoes claim they went home after dropping him and Joran claims he "walked" home. That is hard to believe. He went to the casino the next night and his father says he picked him up at McDonalds at 2300 (sounds like funtyteehundret- haha). But he walked! Joran "walked" home! Then Deepak gives him a ride home the next night.
Did anyone EVER see Joran walking home from the hotels?
Did he ever walk home before this?
I bet Joran never walked more than 1 mile in his life. He walked home? Is that the story? He walked home?
I think I could bury this kid in ten hours of investigation.

What is wrong with the Dutch?

Next they are going to report NH was having sex
with flipper and borrowed his cell phone to call BHT because they were out of sardines---

rons

Jacqueline wrote, two days ago: What does it matter if she was high on crack or eating cotton candy? You don't blame the victim.

if Aruban terroist are holding her hostage that would interest CIA

Prof. I completely agree with you if your comment was directed towards me, but I was just wondering if her friends did say that(because then the theory that she might have died of an overdose and Joran panicked would make more sense). In any case, even if she was stoned, drunk and involved in an orgy it does not justify her disappearing without a trace.

If I was aware of three young men in my area being the last ones seen with a young and pretty Aruban girl that was now missing, and I knew anything about any of these young men, their behavior, their habits, their character, their "partying," and their other activities, I would immediately contact the appropriate authorities, and tell them everything I knew about the "suspects."

There are those of you on Aruba who saw these same young men, Joran van der Sloot and the Kalpoe brothers, from time to time, and some among you saw them on the night in question. None...not one of you has been reported to have come forward with any information about them and/or their actions.

Why? Are you folks afraid? If so, of what?

I've heard other Dutch inhabitants speak up in defense of Joran, saying what a charming and nice guy his is while photographic and video clearly shows the 17-year-old privileged Dutch boy publicly and illegally drinking alcoholic beverages and gambling, sometimes in the company of his judge-hopeful Dutch pappa Paulus van der Sloot.

But the silence of local native Aruba citizens is deafening, even when a couple of apparently innocent black security guards are implicated by the Dutch boy and his two Surinamese buddies.

Why? Why are you not protesting that miscarriage of justice? Are you afraid? Of what?

We see a protest demonstration against the U-S media at your Courthouse, complaining about American media exposure of your island's obvious ineptness or unwillingness to disclose information about possibly corrupt Dutch authorities' and Aruba officials' mishandling of this investigation and evident inability to assure Americans and the world that fair and equal justice will prevail. They do not protest the secrecy of Aruba's Dutch system; they protest the public exposure this so-called investigation is getting in the USA and around the world. I pay close attention, noticing that the people falsely accusing the victim, her family, the U-S citizens from Alabama and we Americans are mostly white Dutch inhabitants. Why?

And why do you not complain about that? Or do they and their views accurately reflect those of local native citizens of Aruba? If not, why don't the real Arubans speak up? Are all local native Arubans afraid of the obviously influential and privileged Dutch?

It is time that those among you who know anything about the disappearance of Natalee Holloway and/or Joran van der Sloot, the Kalpoes and any others that might be involved in this crime speak up, tell the authorities or the press what you know.

ATTENTION, ARUBA! PLEASE HELP US RECOVER NATALEE HOLLOWAY.

http://spaces.msn.com/members/AbleAdvocateDAN/PersonalSpace.aspx?_c

Where are the security camera tapes from the McDonalds?

BTW, Greta reported on the Fox website, she has rec'd a call to return to the US immediately-

carla where have you watched interviews w/her friends i would like to see them

gab -- I'm glad you brought this up --- A couple of weeks ago, a CNN reporter walked the route from the beach to Joren's house that he claims he took after leaving Natalee.

The reporter pointed out that there were numerous business security cameras along the route that would have shown if this really happened.

Guess what? These tapes were not collected; by the time LE got around to it, they had been erased or taped over.

professor:

We want to know what happened to Natalee too. We are also victims here and are still puzzled at what we are seeing. Aruba IS a safe place, especially for tourists. Tourists are treated like gold here, be they American, European, Asian, etc.
I've lived here my whole life and this is the first time I ever see such a case happen here. It is truly an exception and I'm still having a hard time believing that our little rock is being potrayed as a violent and dangerous place when it's absolutely not true. Don't try to tell me otherwise, you've never been here and you don't know what it's like to live here. I wouldn't trade it for anywhere else.
I see many violents crimes all over the world on the news and it makes me feel alot safer that I live here.
Crimes are not often committed against Americans and NO, Arubians are not protesting against Americans, they are protesting against the media's bad coverage and rating-hungry story twisting. The media is not telling the truth, they are twisting everything and as an Arubian I say it upsets me to see the Aruban image tainted this way when we are nothing like the media says we are.
Ofcourse I question the local law enforcement and their actions, ofcourse I'm upset that nothing seems to be concrete, ofcourse I want to see Joran jailed, I honestly think he did it. I don't believe a word he says. But who am I, a simple Arubian, to say anything or to tell the investigators be they American or Arubian what's the right thing to do?
And Natalee could not have drowned, her body would've been found near the shore of Arashi because that's where the current takes everything that lingers in Aruban waters.

any news on the deep water divers ?

ss. http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,160385,00.html

this is the only one that i could find.

dissapointed... what do you think he did to her.. give me your theroy

The media isn't twisting ANYthing, DA. You just don't like the story that they're telling. They're telling the story of a group of known liars, with close connections to the Police Commissioner, who saw, or who caused "something bad" to happen to Natalee Holloway, and were then able to cover their tracks IN BROAD DAYLIGHT. Now, what exactly is it that's getting twisted here? Please inform me.

If I was aware of three young men in my area being the last ones seen with a young and pretty Aruban girl that was now missing, and I knew anything about any of these young men, their behavior, their habits, their character, their "partying," and their other activities, I would immediately contact the appropriate authorities, and tell them everything I knew about the "suspects."

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
How else do you think the authorities know of their partying and illegal activities? Hint hint.
If I knew anything I'd be the first to talk and most Arubians think the same way I do.


And Aruba does not have terrorists as we are too insignificant and honestly no Arubian has the balls to do so either.

Professor..I emailed your letter to Senator Shelby in reference to travel advisories...
to Dee and Russ Fine. This morning I received a return email from Dee Fine saying they are going to post the letter on their website. Dee also stated that they are getting letters from people across the US wanting to know what they can do to help. I mentioned to Dee that the letter was your idea..just wanted to let you know your work/letter had moved onward.... :)

Disappointed Arubian: you don't think Natalee Holloway and her family has not terrorized

Professor:

You don't know what's happening here, you can't say you know what's true. You can only rely on the media and as an Arubian I'm telling you they are twisting their stories in hopes of better ratings.
They potray Aruba as a dangerous and violent place when it really isn't. Everything here is laid back, people are actually friendly by nature and don't expect anything in return. Arubians are humble and conservative people, why must the press taint this image? Ratings.


ss:

I think it was most likely accidental overdose. I do not tend to generalize, but from what I know and the people I've met, the Dutch tend to be cowards and too afraid to commit any serious crime. Again, this is just my opinion based on the Dutch people I personally know. It may not be completely true.
Maybe Joran gave her too much to handle and he got scared when she overdosed and somehow got rid of the body, although I find it very suspicious that no body has been found. I don't know, this is just a speculation. Many things could have happened.

how close is curacao to aruba and does anyone know is they have searched there or other islands ?

How do we think we learned of the partying and other illegal activities? From Joran's tickle sites. From casino security cameras, etc. Not from any courageous informant. Tell us something we don't already know.

Disappointed, I'm still waiting. What SPECIFICALLY is it about my summary that is inaccurate?

interesting.. i too find it odd that their is no body.. are drugs as rampant as claimed to on this board.. i imagine if you want something bad enough you will find it.. what about the possibility of them parting ways via walking him to go home , her to holiday inn adn her being picked up by someother person or group of people.. is it to far to walk ?

Where are the security camera tapes from the McDonalds?

BTW, Greta reported on the Fox website, she has rec'd a call to return to the US immediately-


Posted by: gab | July 7, 2005 10:04 AM
--------------------------------------

Do they have the angles we need at McD's? It's a good idea, and important to check it out for sure. I wish we could get some sort of breifing concerning these developments. Funny thing is what if we get to the end and then they say they never checked that? What if there are things the investigators can not see but would have saw if they accepted a public forum?

DISAPPOINTED ARUBIAN -

I have been on your "little rock" Aruba. I am very familiar with the whole of it...business (both legal and illegal), including the tourism related businesses and others...the people, both the influential and privileged Dutch and your local native citizens...and your closed, tightly controlled and rather secret so-called law enforcement and highly self-protective Dutch government, all endemic in a Kingdom. And I have spent quite a bit of time on Aruba.

I am a friend of the local native people of Aruba. I wish all of you well.

But you must stand up for yourselves and your visitors unless you want to see jobs disappearing as tourism declines.

And you must insist on equal and fair treatment for all if you are ever going to improve your lives.

There is a big and instantly evident difference between the lifestyles of the advantaged Dutch inhabitants and the common existence of the local native citizens of Aruba.

"This is the first time I ever saw such a case happen here."

Know why? A loving and concerned American parent went into action, focused her available resources on it immediately, and then the U-S and world press started showing it to the world. And Aruba media could no longer ignore it. So this time you "saw" it.

Wonder how many things "happened" that you never "saw" or heard about because of Dutch authorities' and Aruba officials' secrecy?

It is past time that the Dutch veil of secrecy be lifted and that Dutch dominance end on beautiful Aruba.

But it is up to Aruba's local native citizens.

Speak out, stand up for what is right, and insist that justice be fair and equal for all of the people living or visiting on your island.

Aruba is ruled by a privileged minority of Dutch and other influential "expats," when the majority of Aruba's citizens should decide what happens or doesn't "happen."

Silence changes nothing, and every voice can make a difference. But a majority begins with one.

It could begin with you.

Choose LIBERTY and FREEDOM...and JUSTICE for ALL!

- A CARING AMERICAN

Professor:

I'm tired of repeating myself. Just because we have a different justice system does not give anyone the right to call it 'inept'. FOX News made Aruba look like a violent and dangerous place when it's absolutely not true. CNN reported that the protesters were protesting agains Americans and the Holloway family which isn't true, they were protesting against the media's false accusations. And by the way, a small group of 50 protesters does not represent the island of Aruba and yes, I disagree with them to say anything about the Holloway family as they do not know what the family is going through.
Some Arubians just can't help it, as some of them are ignorant, uneducated and they form the minority of the island.

SS:

No, it's not a long walk but the suggestion is somewhat out of this world. The odds are very slim that she walked alone to the hotel and was picked up by someone else. If it was like that, why did Joran and the Kalpoe brothers lie in the first place? They are guilty, I agree.

With all due respect to Disappointed Aruban - her attitude (which I think typical of Arubans) is the reason this case can't be solved. Arubans are in denial - they won't believe, no matter how much evidence, that one of their locals would kill a defenseless young woman. So at least three Arubans have come forward to lie to help Joran. But nobody has come forward with truthful information to help Beth get her daughter back or find out what happened to her.

And, the idea Natallee died of an accidental overdose is malicious gossip - it has no basis at all. If Joran slipped her drugs which killed her that is still murder.

not sure of anything.. just something i thought i would throw out there. If they have so much evidence linking the Kalpoe brothers to "something" why let them go ? I guess i just find it hard to believe Joran (if he did it) could withstand the pressure of the interogations and how he could have done something so well (not sure thats the right wording) that he has not been clearly caught...

Carla...

Troll warning...name:

Skeptic...

The troll had the nerve to attack me a few forums back... I advise you not to believe anything that Skeptic posts unless you know it to be true.

No Natalee was not on the beach with a friend doing Coke.....remember you heard that from a Dutch source...they love to blame and condem victims there...character attack...an attempt to destroy Natalee's good character...propaganda...


Disappointed Arubian. I'd like to thank you for your posts, I enjoy reading them very much. I think that you represent Aruba well and at least we get a view of what's really going on at this moment in Aruba. For example, I thought that the protests were against the Holloway/Twitty family, but if they are indeed against the portrayal of Aruba by the media, then I find them justifiable.

BARTHOLOMEW -

"Three Arubans" have not "come forward."

Two Surinamese Kalpoe boys and Steve Croes from Curacao spoke up in support of privileged Dutch "loverboy" Joran.

Local native Arubans have been conspicuosly quiet.

And I'm beginning to wonder if DISAPPOINTED ARUBIAN is Dutch.

If not, DISAPPOINTED ARUBIAN is sure on the wrong side in this issue.

The Truth. Thanks for the update. I had my doubts about the accuracy of that post.

The Truth. Thanks for the update. I had my doubts about the accuracy of that post.

Sad to say but in the event that scumbag Joran,'Little OJ'walks away from this a free man his life will be changed forever.
He will never come here to the states unless he's a total idiot.
He can forget college in florida and certainly alabama!
All arubans will probably hate him for, forever giving the island a bad reputation.
I can't believe that little pussy was smiling everytime a camera was around.I mean even if you are innocent you probably shouldn't be smiling.
I want to say to him'Dude...whats with the smile...you ever had a large country pissed off at you before?'
One way or the other he's finished.....he'll always have the OJ stigma attached to him.In the future lets hope the aruban police go back to school and learn how to investigate a disappearance within the first 48 hours............MORONS

well bartholomew give us your take on what happened.. and how do you know an accidental overdose is malicious gossip..

sorry for double post!!

Bartholomew:

You're not reading. I said I DO believe the boys did it, especially Joran. And he's not Arubian, he's Dutch. And I am not in denial, I know for a fact that Arubians have no balls to commit serious crimes which is the reason why most of our prison cells are populated by foreigners.

I don't want to help Joran, if it were up to me I'd walts in there, kick him where it hurts till he tells me what happened. But ofcourse then I'd get arrested. But I assure you, if this case isn't solved soon, a pissed Arubian will most likely attack Joran personally as soon as he or she gets a chance.
Ofcourse it's murder if Joran gave her too much drugs, I was just speculating on the cause of death not either or not it's murder. It IS murder in my eyes. What's it going to take to make you see that I do want this guy jailed, I do want Natalee found, I do want justice, just like every other Arubian on this island.
Stop this senseless battle, the focus is supposed to be on finding Natalee.

the Aruban gestapo needs to be disbanded

Disappointed Aruban, I don't see Aruba being portrayed as a violent and dangerous place by our US media. I've never heard this mentioned at all.

Many questions have been raised by our media, questions that I have myself as do others. For instance, why were the 3 individuals last seen with Natalee were allowed to roam free for 10 days based upon some story they gave to police, a story they later admitted they lied about. The Kalpoe brothers and Joran Van Der Sloot should have been searched (as well as their homes, cars, etc.) for any possible physical forensic evidence IMMEDIATELY, not much later. They were not, however. By allowing them to roam free for 10 days, these 3 boys had the opportunity to dispose of evidence. Admittedly, the police did follow them electronically, BUT physical forensic evidence is much more valuable in court when seeking a conviction, especially when you have no body. Let us not forget that Paul Van Der Sloot remarked soon after Natalee's disappearance that without a body, the boys need not worry. Paul Van Der Sloot has admitted to saying this.

It appears to me and others that these boys were shown preferential treatment because of who they were and who they knew. If you recall, the two guards that were never even seen with Natalee were treated much differently than Joran Van Der Sloot and the Kalpoe brothers. They were arrested just based on some story that the 3 suspects gave the police. Many of us find it interesting that these black security guards WERE searched for any forensic evidence, interrogated, and, etc., immediately.

In my opinion, the US media has never implied or stated directly that it isn't safe to go to Aruba. Arubans should direct their anger towards the proper group, the police department. THEY are the ones that have brought about all of your bad press.

Dan,

I hope that you will consider opening a forum
where we can collect names and letters to send
to state government represenatives. I saw someone post a blog a few forums back that they had a collection of 400 contacts..I would love to have that list...

Dee and Russ Fine of WERC Radio in Bham would post all of the names, snail addresses, letters,
and email addresses.

There is a large apartment complex on fire in Bham right now...our tv coverage is cutting back and forth between the London Attacks, the Bham fire and Hurricane Dennis who appears to be on his way to Alabama. It is going to be a lonnnnnnnng weekend..Dennis is due here Sunday..

Disappointed Arubian,
I've enjoyed reading your post and understand what you are saying....:)

Able Advocate Dan,
I have been closely involved with Aruba for nearly 20 years and have witnessed several similar incidents. I wish the citizens of Aruba were able to speak up and protest this miscarriage of justice but unfortunately this is a way of life for them. The Aruban's government is set up so that they are dependent on the government - free medical benefits, guaranteed jobs, etc. Many people in Aruba are not native Arubans, but do have legal papers to live there -- they can be "invited" to leave if they stand up to the government. The Dutch are the priveleged people in Aruba, but Aruba needs Netherlands' support therefore they cannot break away.

Local native Arubans have been conspicuosly quiet.

And I'm beginning to wonder if DISAPPOINTED ARUBIAN is Dutch.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

I personally don't like the Dutch, only a handfull of them and I am Arubian.
If I knew anything I would've talked, if anyone knew anything they would talk. What you need to understand is that the Dutch are very reserved and picky when it comes to friends. Let's just say they like to hang with their type, like the Surinamers who are techically Dutch as they speak the language and have closer connections with Holland than we do.
I'm guessing, again only guessing, only a handfull actually KNEW Joran and I bet they were very close friends, so naturally they're standing up for him. I bet no even the kids at his school knew him enough.
Others just don't know him. Most Arubians didn't know he existed until his name started showing up in the local newspapers.
I've heard stories, but this is Aruba, gossip is one of the most common phenomena here so you can't believe everything you hear.

Disappointed Arubian

I personally have lost all respect for your country. I am sorry for you..but your govt represents you, your police represent you,
your laws represent you and in the case of
Natalee I have seen the poorest, terrible police
work in my life..and no one down there has anything but an excuse as to why things are like they are...I have not seen one person in authority there that should even be in such a position. You might want to consider moving because this is not a threat but a promise..things
are in the works here in the US to dismantle the American part of the Arubian Economy..

We will not tolerate the poor performance/response of your country in reference to this case. I am personally going to do all I can to aid the intolerance.

Disappointed Arubian: I haven't heard of a protest at the courthouse for justice in this case, all I hear is whining for us to go away

the truth-
Please consider that the judiciary officials are appointed by the Netherlands-they are not elected by the people.

Disappointed Arubian-
Will you please explain to me how much influence--the citizens of Aruba--have on laws, law-makers, and LE authorities. Popular vote?

Dissappointed - those kids sure were able to identify Joran as soon as they were asked by Charles Croes. In fact, they were able to lead the police to his home. Please gets the facts straight.
I want to be on your side, but right now, I can't - not and sleep at night. There is a young woman missing (AMERICAN) and her parents, friends and FAMILY need the help of the gov't on your small island. They are getting some help, but mostly they are getting grief.
I urge you to write a letter to your gov't if you are dissappointed.

I ask everyone to contact three travel agents in their own home town and bring them up to date on all the news out of Aruba. (Except for Birmingham. Please. They already know.) Be factual and objective. And urge them to talk to their contacts in Aruba and let them know that this "situation" is not going to go away with a little fancy PR campaign. Let them know that we want Natalee.

The truth:

It's Americans like you that disappoint me. We are supposed to help each other out not drown each other because of political and judicial differences.
Haven't you read what Hopeful posted? We are dependant, the government has US tied with our hands behind our backs. Don't you think we suffer in this too? We are going down because of small selfcentered group of people and all we actually CAN do is complain about it.
I am ashamed of the government, the media and the law enforcement, EVERYONE is. They do not represent us, especially because most of them aren't even Arubians. Most of them are Dutch. But ofcourse, you already knew that right?

Did anyone else notice that when Greta interviewed the cell phone guy last week, he said that when he went to the beach area and asked the kids there who drove a small silver car that the kids said Joran. My hisband and I thought that was strange since the car belonged to one of the brothers. Anyone else think that was strange?

Dictatorship?

Then the people of Aruba need to demand change
unless your happy with the Dictatorship..

Dictatorship type of government is the next closest thing to slavery..and you tolerate that
type of judical system in Aruba?

does anyone know if they have searched other islands

Disappointed - you are just one individual. I don't want to attack you personally. You sound like a nice person. But, Aruba is collectively responsible for this cover-up. It couldn't be happening without the assistance of a lot of people. The Dutch are the main ones behind it - it is obvious from watching TV that all high positions in Aruba are occupied by white Dutch. But native Arubans need to be out protesting the injustice being done to the Holloways - instead I saw numerous native Arubans protesting the American media. That is not right - in any country.

In the future lets hope the aruban police go back to school and learn how to investigate a disappearance within the first 48 hours........

----------

Bob L. -- This really is one of the most damning pieces of evidence of something fishy -- the way they handled the first 48, nay, first 240 hours.

As a former member of law enforcement, I can tell you what a red flag this is.... Not searching the homes or cars; waiting 10 days to arrest the suspects; the shameless diversionary, time-biding ploy of arresting the security guards; not pulling every outdoor surveillence tape in a five-mile radius of the Holiday Inn, ad nauseum.

This was designed to affect an eventual cold case, and it's working.

What is really offensive is the attempt to blame this on "the system." This has nothing to do with the system. This represents LE incompetence on such a scale that it could be nothing other than an attempt to cover Joren's ass. (See PVDS and Van Strateen, etc...)

Disappointed Arubian I understand what you are saying. The anger is at your police and government at dragging their feet. Natalee body would have been found if things were put in place quickly. I still hope they find her quickly so her killers will be arrested and failing that be known as dangerous citizens of aruba

Hopper

How are you doin today???

Is it true they fired Marianne Croes?

Have been off and on very sporatically but thought I read that.

Excellent post Disappointed Arubian. Hopefully the voice of your people will bring some changes down there because of this ordeal.

Concerned, I noticed that..Thought it was strange too.

Sending letters to Congessmen and getting what you want...

You have to be from the congressman's district, or you don't exist in his world. Constituent support is crucial to drawing the congressman's attention. Only voters in his/her district matter to him/her. And that's where support comes in: At least one person from as many other districts as possible wanting exactly the same thing as you (even if for different reasons) greatly increases your chances of getting what you want. It gets more congressmen involved. One person can make a difference. But it's better if at least one person is in each district
Your congressman's main interests are your district and your vote.

These are the committees I would recommend for this situation. You can find their e-mail adddy's here:http://www.visi.com/juan/congress/
Look for someone in your district! This is important!

House Committee on Homeland Security

House Committee on International Relations

House Subcommittee on the Western Hemisphere

House Subcommittee on Crime Terrorism and Homeland Security

Senate Subcommittee on Homeland Security

Senate Subcommittee on International Trade and Finance

Senate Committee on Foreign Relations

Senate Subcommittee on International Operations and Terrorism

Senate Committee on Homeland Security & Governmental Affairs

Senate Subcommittee on Crime and Drugs

Senate Committee on the Judiciary

I recommend your message request some kind of specific action and a response back. Here is an example letter:

Dear ____________:

As a concerned citizen in your district, several recent international events have prompted this message to you. Today’s terrorist attack in London and the disappearance on Natalee Hollaway in Aruba have been a reawakening to the lessons of 9/11 and this dangerous world of today.
Having followed the disturbing developments in the investigation in Aruba, I began researching Aruba through the State Department web site. This website led to more research and now I have serious concerns that while customs officials seem to be making some headway into transshipment of drugs, bank secrecy laws and possible government corruption make Aruba quite appealing to money laundering operations to fund terrorism.

President Bush, in a statement to representatives of over 120 countries at the Third Global Forum on Fighting Corruption and Safeguarding Integrity in May 2003, remarked that "Fighting corruption is essential to meeting the great challenges of our times....When corruption flourishes, it weakens confidence in public institutions such as law enforcement, and undermines the honest values that democracy depends upon. All people deserve legal systems that spread opportunity, instead of protecting the narrow interests of a well-connected few."

I am gravely concerned this may be the case in Aruba. I realize the Bureau for International Narcotics and Law Enforcement Affairs is committed to strengthening the international fight against corruption. I am asking that you sponsor a letter to the following people at the State Department requesting a copy of the most recent annual CFATF (Caribbean Financial Action Task Force) report from Aruba and their analysis of progress, if any that has been made since the original CFATF meeting that was sponsored by Aruba.

State Department

Condoleezza Rice
Secretary of State
,
Nancy J. Powell
Acting Assistant Secretary, Bureau for International Narcotics and Law Enforcement Affairs (Corruption)

Paula J. Dobriansky
Under Secretary, Global Affairs

Roger Francisco Noriega
Assistant Secretary, Bureau of Western Hemisphere Affairs

Deborah A. Bolton
Consul General, Netherlands Antilles and Aruba

I would appreciate a copy of your letter to the Staff at the Sate Department.

In the event that you disagree that this is something that would be productive to do at this time, before the September elections in Aruba, I would respectfully request a response back with an alternative idea or method of measuring any progress Aruba has made in combating corruption and money laundering.

I look forward to your response.

Respectfully,


Name
Address

Mickey John said, without any trepidation that Deepak said that they figured, "Well normally in Aruba they'd find the girl with some beach bum or in a crack house or something..."

That is a key point.

Folks, I'm sorry to say this, but I've seen Joran's Tickle sites and those of his buddies, and the Aruban girls seemed to be gettin' preeeety friendly with those Dutch guys. Even the 15 and 14 and 13 year-old girls. And Steven Croes wasn't Dutch. And the people holding those signs out in front of the courthouse yesterday weren't all blonde-haired, blue-eyed Dutchmen. Seems like the Aruban people have gotten pretty cozy with this "Dutch occupation." So, if you want to claim that you're just as p*ssed off at the Dutch as we are, then you need to show some backbone.

Maybe FBI will update their database when the arubans update their crime stats.

Hey Cab Girl-
Today is YOUR day...beep, beep!!

Bobup-
“I haven't heard of a protest at the courthouse for justice in this case, all I hear is whining for us to go away”

Might this be a result of internal misinformation? It appears as Arubian citizens are being misled into thinking that they, as a whole, are being attacked. Disappointed Arubian has demonstrated this possibility. Have Arubian citizens fallen prey to a media misinformation campaign produced by their own authorities? How many fingers do these authorities have…when will the finger pointing end?! Now I understand the significance of the Octopus…and I’m not referring to the boat!

Well I think it is obvious the VDS and Kalpoes have found their way here!!!!

All you people blaming the victim and pointing the finger at the Victims families are showing your ignorance.

Instead of sticking to the facts, you prefer to ignore them and make slanderous and idiotic statements. You people need to look in the mirror and ask yourself why you need to slander an innocent victim and hurl garbage at her family, but defend whomever did this to her.

Humane people would want to find Natalee and help her family. Humane people would want the guilty people locked up so this cant happen again.

Ignorant people are those that sit around and make slanderous comments that are backed up with no facts about the victim.

Please go look at yourself in a mirror and ask yourself why you arent more concerned about the fate of this girl and punishing those responsible.

It speaks a great deal about ones character when they feel the need to to further victimize Natalee and her family.

Empathy is a wonderful thing, you should try it.

Concerned, I noticed that..Thought it was strange too.

Moonshadow what happens if you live in canada?

Moonshadow-
THANK YOU! And...welcome back to lobbying!!

Tanya, I don't know how the Canadian Government works, but you must have some kind of local government representation, yes?

Disappointed Arubian

Its an Arubian or Dutch like you that disappoints me...now how did that sound? And that is not the issue here..the issue is Natalee, she is a victim
and the crime committed against her has taken her physical being from us...Natalee was not for theft or sale. There is no price that will replace her..but we do demand
justice in the US and we have not seen any in reference to Natalee's diappearance.

If someone does not know what to say in Aruba do they just lie? or if someone commits a crime in Aruba do they just lie over and over to get out of it? I mean that is sick Disappointed Arubian.
Thats not justice...

I wonder if teh brothers let Joran drive the car. Kinda strange since the mother told Great how ticky her son was about his car. Maybe joran told people it was his car. He's lies about other things. I even remember it being reported at first that it was his car and how he was allowed to have this car when he wasn't even old enough to drive.

Disappointed Arubian

Its an Arubian or Dutch like you that disappoints me...now how did that sound? And that is not the issue here..the issue is Natalee, she is a victim
and the crime committed against her has taken her physical being from us...Natalee was not for theft or sale. There is no price that will replace her..but we do demand
justice in the US and we have not seen any in reference to Natalee's diappearance.

If someone does not know what to say in Aruba do they just lie? or if someone commits a crime in Aruba do they just lie over and over to get out of it? I mean that is sick Disappointed Arubian.
Thats not justice...

Chic

LOL

I have no doubt today will be my day.:)

Did you by any chance here that Marianne Croes was fired? Is it just a rumour?

LOL Chica...it was just a matter of time, *sigh*

The 50 protesters in front of the court do not represent the island of Aruba. I disagree with them for their actions and ugly remarks. They should've considered being a bit more civil about it.
And don't generalize, the Dutch aren't all blonde blue-eyed. You have black Dutch, brunettes, coffee skin, black hair, they have everything.

And this is Aruba. Ofcourse everyone knows where he lives. The minute you point your finger to a stranger, a random Arubian could tell you he/she saw this person in this district and they will find his house.
This is Aruba, you forget what impact the size has on the island. If a crime is committed here, in less than 2 hours the whole island will know without needing to hear it from the press or the police. Things are different here, you have to understand this.

I go out for a few minutes to a supermarket, in less than 10 minutes, someone I know will call on my phone "hey, I heard you're a this place, what's up?"
It's that easy to know what's going on here. People talk.

Another example, you go for a trip to a club somewhere, before you get home that night, half the island already knows where you were at which time, who you were with, how many drinks you've had and how long you stayed where.

What do you know about empathy, CG? You're a Canadian. Now, get back in that igloo. :)

Many posts have referenced a 3:00am phone call made to the Twitty/Holloway residence...

Does anyone have a link or reference to this phone call or is it only speculation?

If there is a reference to it please post it.

Just curious: How do people feel about Joren coming to America?

If he walks in this case, would it not take some nerve for him to even come here? If nothing else, he has lied and/or witheld info that the Holloways could use to find their daughter.


Hey everybody... guess theres not going to be many updates today....so if anybody gets any info please post it :)

Hey everybody... guess theres not going to be many updates today....so if anybody gets any info please post it :)

Excellent letter, Moonshadow. I shall use it.

Disappointed Arubian

I don't doubt what you are saying about people knowing where you've been and who you talked to etc., It is the same where I live.LOL

My question is why doesn't anyone know what happened to Natalie??

What rumours have you heard on the island about this situation??

Hey AtlJoie. :)

Are you not reading what I post?
Despite all ugly remarks I will still stand for the Holloway family and the Americans who want Natalee found. I want justice too, I want Natalee found, I want the guilty parties arrested and yes I find it disturbing how Joran keeps changing his story.
Aruba did not kill Natalee, stop attacking us with threats of boycotting and focus on the real issue: Finding Natalee.

Do I still disappoint you? How?

Moonshadow-
My houseguest is a lobbyist…thank you for not making me disrupt her vacation!!

Thanks Professor. It would be great to get at least one e-mail from as many different districts as possible. Everyone here should send a copy to others in their districts too...that get's their attention fast...when they think it's an orgainized effort in their district.

Bullshark

Yeah you are right, what was I thinking.:)

I have been out all morning searching for Petey our pet polar bear, his leash broke and pulled a big part of our igloo down.:0).

I have contacted the Aruban LE for assistance!!!

LOL

"Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful citizens
can change the world. Indeed, it is the only thing that ever has."

Margaret Mead
American Anthropologist

Lol Chica! She NEEDS a vacation, I'm sure!

Yes, Disappointed Aruban.

This is what is known as 'living in a small town'. Aruba is what? 9 miles by 14 miles...smaller than most 'small towns'in the states. That is why I too find it incredible that no body saw or heard anything. What about neighbors...other people on the roads or even beach?

Canadian:

I've heard several ugly rumors but I couldn't just base conclusions on just rumors.

One I've heard is that people are saying she's buried behind Farro Blanco (lighthouse), others say she must've been shipped to Venezuela and sold to prostitution, others say she may have done it deliberately to escape. All just rumors.

Rumors also say that this is not the first time Natalee has disappeared. She went missing for 8 days in Puerto Rico (or was it Costa Rica?) and two weeks in Jamaica, they said she went on a party spree with local Jamaians. Ofcourse these are all rumors and I wouldn't know which to believe.

Disappointed Aruban,

Canadian Girl brings up a good point. If everyone knows what goes on, what is being said about Natalee's disappearance? If what you said is true, then someone is withholding information. For what reason? Afraid of retaliation by the LE and govt?

I'm sure there are a lot of people that would really like to know what is being said on the island.

AVA-
Very few facts on the early-morning phone call...numerous rumors!

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,161233,00.html

Note: C. Croes owns a "cell phone rental company"...not a "sail rental company" (transcript error!)

DA --

There is one thing you can do for us.

Stake out the police station. Next time Joren is escorted out, jump in there and slap that arrogant grin off his face. Don't hurt him; we don't want to make a martyr out him. Some are already trying to do that now. PHULEESE!!

We would consider this an excellent good faith gesture. ;)

Can Girl-
I don't think that M. Croes was officially "fired". Her role as spokesperson for the prosecutor’s office was eliminated. Karin Janssen is now serving this position.

And…I’m going to have to eliminate my position as Can Girl antagonist…Bullshark is doing a much better job!! HONK HONK!!

Canadian Girl

That was a great post you made earlier concerning the bashing of the innocent parties to this tragedy - we are seeing it more and more. Natalee did not disappear on her own and it does not matter how many drinks she may have had or if she was dancing on her head. And no, the Aruban people in general are not responsible, but the entire system that governs them are surely responsible that this charade has gone on for so long. We can list many things that they have blundered in this so called investigation, but we all know what they are.

Terps:

Many Arubians have been contemplating that. I would personally enjoy slapping the grin off his face as well. I might need the assistance of a baseball bat to feel satisfied though. :)

send a "ghost" down there to get the real story and to make a few locals disappear down there in aruba

Did anyone else notice that when Greta interviewed the cell phone guy last week, he said that when he went to the beach area and asked the kids there who drove a small silver car that the kids said Joran. My hisband and I thought that was strange since the car belonged to one of the brothers. Anyone else think that was strange?

Posted by: concerned American mom and teacher | July 7, 2005 12:03 PM
------------------------------------
Yes, I said the same thing three days ago and I got a response that went something like; "WHAT!...did you just say?"

And that was it!

Yes, at first it seemed that way to me also when C Croes said it, but over time I began to realize he just didn't to a good job of telling the story.
He emphasized the car as if the boy associated the car with Joran, but he actually meant to tell us that the boy recognized Joran prior to associating Joran with the car. I danced around with the idea for awhile that Satish and Joran were often seen in this car together and they were good friends, which could be true, but then I blew it off.
I just took it that the boys in th lot recognized Joran and the car was meaningless, but I keep that in the back of my mind, and I'm sure you'll do the same.

Then, along comes Jody Bearman with a somewhat different story and you find yourself struggling to make both stories make sense as one story. It can be......try. http://www.cdnn.info/news/travel/t050618.html

Isn't that odd. There's an island 6 miles by 19 miles, where everybody knows everybody's business. Where you can't even go to the grocery store without your cell phone ringing with some latest gossip. And nobody, but nobody, has the vaguest notion what happened to Natalee Holloway.

Razor

Thank You for the kind words.:)

Chica

LOL
Thanks for the info re. M Croes.

Professor:

That's the whole mistery. She truly disappeared without a trace and it's bothering us very much. We want answers as well.
I'm thinking of sending an email to the minister of justice and truly speak my mind about the case.

LOL DA. THAT was funny. :)

Chica, I see no reason we cannot tag-team.

Is there a reason M. Croes position was done away with, or do they just want Janssen and Tito handling the press from now on?

Disappointed Arubian,

I am behind you 100%

If you Do decide to e-mail Rudy Croes, please share his response with us.

Disappointed Aruban:

I may have missed some publicity, but have tried
to keep up from beginning of "disappearance of
Natallie" --- My own opinion (Based solely on
information presented publicly through various
channels re: Aruban population AS THAT IS ALL I
HAVE TO MEASURE BY) is that the local populace
is made up predominately of caring, hard-working
people who have gone to great personal efforts
to help in anyway ---- I have heard nothing but
good about the Arubans and Mrs. Twitty was the
first to state that she thought the 2 Security
Guards were being set up as scape goats and had
absolutely nothing to do with her daughter's
disappearance. I have read statements by other
family members and have yet to see a derogatory
statement directed toward the Aruban people.

Obviously, and through no real fault of the local
residents, the Civil Servants do not fall in the
same class. Perhaps local people are dominated
by fear from these powerful people and also have
lived with their "rulings" and, and in the name
of law-abiding citizens have merely accepted their self-serving Justice system since:

(1) With NO crime, a majority of people probably
have had no dealings with the Police.

(2) As good citizens, many of us are taught to
respect Civil Servants....that they are
in office to protect and serve. With no
personal experience with their ineptness,
why not ?

(3) Possible 'racial' hold-over ideas exist from years
gone by -- there will always be area's within
any location that harbors prejudice.

(4) Frustration, rumors and NO progress (being
justified by people with no hands-on investigatory experience who refuse REAL help
from pro's) and knowing the local people have
cooperated with these so-called detectives and
no new ideas surfacing or information arising...
Of course.....truly concerned people are losing
patience, questioning their officials, imaginations and rumors are breeding contempt at
every point......Naturally, those who just
'want this to go away at any price' for 'whatever' reasons will instigate internal
problems in order to draw attention away from
the real issues -- "Playing" on the emotions of
those involved (the family as well as the concerned local residents) is definetly taking
unfair advantage of good people.

In my heart, and after much soul searching, I
can honestly say: I DO NOT BELIEVE ANYONE FROM
OR IN ANY COUNTRY WHO 'LOST' A DAUGHTER THIS WAY
WOULD BE CONTENT WITH ANY ASPECT EXHIBITED BY
THE PEOPLE IN CHARGE OF THIS INVESTIGATION.

KEEP the basic, simple problem in view and don't
be sidetracked by the obvious "diversion" techniques. When a family who has lost their
child for over a month and has dealt with days
and weeks of "NOTHING" from officials as well as
the personal daily and nightly stress and trauma, with all hope fading ......when
a family under this much tragedy can do nothing
but praise the local population of any island,
country or even group-------that is the absolute
recommendation !

Thanks 'Chica'. I saw that interview with C. Croes the night it aired and have read Greta's transcript many times. I never have found anything factual about this 'phone call'...only speculation.

Every adversity, every failure, every heartache carries with it
the seed of an equal or greater benefit.
- Napoleon Hill

"The most destructive thing for any society is for someone to commit a major crime. And get away with it."

Margaret Mead
American Anthropologist


Keep your fears to yourself, but share your courage with others. - Robert Louis Stevenson

Did anyone else notice that when Greta interviewed the cell phone guy last week, he said that when he went to the beach area and asked the kids there who drove a small silver car that the kids said Joran. My hisband and I thought that was strange since the car belonged to one of the brothers. Anyone else think that was strange
_______________________
Yes, I did notice it and don't know what to make of it. That is very different from other reports - that the car belonged to the Kalpoes. Maybe Charles Croes was a little confused.

But, I think if anybody else on that island knows anything it would be the high school students who were friends with Joran. Joran was out for what? ten days? afterwards so maybe he talked to a high school chum. I believe Joran is dying to tell somebody how he got away with it.

"do, or not do. There is no try" Yoda, The Empire Strikes Back


Sorry...couldn't help it

hello all

looking for friends in UK right now. cannot find them.

MEGA WORRIED

be back later when i can

I wonder if teh brothers let Joran drive the car. Kinda strange since the mother told Great how ticky her son was about his car. Maybe joran told people it was his car. He's lies about other things. I even remember it being reported at first that it was his car and how he was allowed to have this car when he wasn't even old enough to drive.

Posted by: concerned American mom and teacher | July 7, 2005 12:30 PM
=======================================

I think this is an important point. As I stated earlier, this teenager Joran doesn't like to walk at all. We all know the type.
He claims to have walked home after leaving Natalee at the beach. It's hard to believe. I'm not sure if he ever drove that night. There's some possibility of that. I think he was picked up. He has to be drilled to the wall about how he got home after leaving her. I would play towards that answer but never actaully ask him how he got home, eight hours a day for one week straight.
We can find out how he got home or did not get home from the beach that night. He has to answer that! He DID NOT walk! There is a way to get that answer.

"Sharing your bed with a child is the most loving thing you can do." -- Michael Jackson

MOONSHADOW,

I understand the need to send the letter to a congressman from my district. Does the same apply to senators? Or can I send the letter to both senators from my state? Thanks

Terps that's a sick person to quote. You just made my day. lol.


Hardyandtiny

I don't think he walked home. He seems like the lazy 'I hate to walk' type and I certainly don't believe his lies.

Well, the Holloway saga has been blown off the airwaves by the London terrorism attack, which happened about 3 hours ago.

Posted by: effra | July 7, 2005 07:28 AM

So the terrorist ties start to make more sense.
The dutchies want the media pressure OFF them. They call on their buddies that they have been laundering money for and supporting the terrorist plots.

A little info on Ben King. He seems to have a problem with the US and especially the war in Iraq.

http://benking.com/actnow/

I am betting that Van der Sloot, Van Straaten and few others belong to his gold key club too and this is only part of the information the Holloway-Twitty's want to release. I'd hate to think that the tourist $$ spent in Aruba are being used to support terrorists. But I suspect that is the case because of a few VERY corrupt individuals on that island.
No I don't think that is why Natalee was kidnapped, but because the family had to investigate the kidnapping since the Polis would not, they uncovered this information while they were at it just like we have.

About the Kyoto agreement and this little club.

http://64.233.179.104/search?q=cache:C3SewGON0GMJ:econpapers.repec.org/article/eeeecolec/default35.htm+%22Kyoto+protocol%22+straaten&hl=en&lr=lang_en

Wow Jan Van der Straaten is one of the authors huh?
And wasn't Paulus Vander Sloot ostrisized for his "environmental" stance on a road that would save children's lives but take his property in Holland?

Are these little maggots upset that they were NOT invited to the G-8 summit?


VR wrote: When a family under this much tragedy can do nothing but praise the local population of any island, country or even group-------that is the absolute recommendation !

Response: For whom? The island, or the family?

Phantom, if your Senators sit on any of those committees, that would be great. Reference the committee in you opening. "As a member of such and such committee, I'm sure you share my concerns...

If not, yes, just send to both.

"Sharing your bed with a child is the most loving thing you can do." -- Michael Jackson

Posted by: terps


Terps

I will not even begin to ask why; I was quoting to give some hope and inspiration - yours, on the other "gloved" hand...don't know what to say =)

in all pictures of jvs & friends they show a sign with there fingers [horizontal V for victory] what does this mean?

Three may keep a secret, if two of them are dead.
Ben Franklin

Phantom, if your Senators sit on any of those committees, that would be great. Reference the committee in you opening. "As a member of such and such committee, I'm sure you share my concerns...

I sent mine to Mel Martinez. He sits on the Senate Committee for Foriegn Relations.

If not, yes, just send to both.

in all pictures of jvs & friends they show a sign with there fingers [horizontal V for victory] what does this mean?

News on local radio noon in aruba
The FBI is questioning in Alabama the ex boyfriend and allso the girls that shared her room in aruba.
RADIO says in 72 hours they will solve the case with events no one expects.

nederlands......neverland

aruba.........rubba rubba

alcohol and sex with children


hummmmmmmmmmmmm

Razor --

Your quotes were perfectly appropriate, and I appreciate you sharing them. I meant no disrespect. Just being silly.

Maria - tell us more??

having a hard time accessing this website - is anyone else having problems - most of my posts don't go thru

Moonshadow,

My congressman (Pascrell) and both senators (Lautenberg, Corzine) sit on one or other of those committees. Also sent a letter to SoS Rice.

Eep-

Normally its a "whats up" sign common for teenagers.

Solve the case in 72 hours with events nobody expects? Could this be the comment Jug made about its going to shock everyone???

Island Hopper, Phantom, Professor, Disappointed Arubian, Bullshark, Mrs.JimiHendrix, All-Hi.

The comments lead me to believe you aren't getting at all the idea of what has happened. JVDS led NH to the drug cartel. He left her on the beach. He did not "harm" her. That last part is true only in that he personally did not do her in; he delivered her. He is responsible in the kidnapping of NH. But he will not suffer much for it. He is "connected." He is truly a "pimp" and a "gansta". This is nothing to kid about.

The authorities know this. They choose the status quo. BHT either knows for sure or believes this as well, IMO.

If you want to write letters, write to the DEA and to those who control money laundering. The perpetrators are all part of the "drug cartels". They launder drug monies through the casinos. NH virtues were her demise, sadly. The drug lords received her as a gift. Horrible truth.

The comments at this point can only help to decide whether anyone wants to spend the rest of their life fighting organized crime. That is probably what BHT will have to decide, or whether she may wish to give herself to helping others with missing children who are victims of sex offenders in the U.S.

terps at least we can safely say micheal jackson does not have her lol

Three may keep a secret, if two of them are dead.
Ben Franklin


. . .or if 97,000 of them are Arubans.

Solved in 72 hours with events noone expects? Could this be what Jug was talking about?

Eep,

Its normally a "whats up" sign teenagers use.

Solved in 72 hours with events noone expects? Could this be what Jug was talking about?

Eep,

Its normally a "whats up" sign teenagers use.

maria in 72 hrs the only news i expect is joran walks. I have lost faith in justice

terps we can safely say micheal jackson does not have natalee lol

Solved in 72 hours with events noone expects? Could this be what Jug was talking about?

Eep,

Its normally a "whats up" sign teenagers use.

I agree Kristin, also agree Maria Tell us more!

Solved in 72 hours with events noone expects? Could this be what Jug was talking about?

Eep,

Its normally a "whats up" sign teenagers use.

terps

I know - no problem what-so-ever. I think humor is good, even in the midst of tragedy. Is this true about the FBI now being in Alabama talking to or questioning the friends and ex who were on the trip?

News on local radio noon in aruba
The FBI is questioning in Alabama the ex boyfriend and allso the girls that shared her room in aruba.
RADIO says in 72 hours they will solve the case with events no one expects

Maria, the FBI spoke to those people over a month ago. Do not believe the propaganda machine you call media in Aruba.
Despite the wishing of the dutchnationals in Aruba NO American will be arrested for Natalee's disappearance.

BHT is right on to keep pressure on all suspects. I do see however, under her own legal counsel, I presume, she is changing tactics. Interviews BHT has given the last few days indicates they are going with the Kidnap theory. Mind you, they don't believe this, but with no body as PVDS says "no body, no crime" However if BHT lawyers charge kidnapping, they already have incriminating evidence such as lies by the Kalpoes, Lies by JVDS, the drugging of the drink, the confessions of "She kind of stumbling around at the beach" The confession of having sex, the comment "Something bad happened" I believe BHT has been informed by authorities that Natalee is probably dead, an no body will be recovered. So she has shifted gears onto the kidnapping theory in order to glean at least some justice. AFter all the boy admitted to being with her and then leaving her on the beach.

Now onto PVDS for a minute, has any one considered that he didn't pick up JVDS at 4am at the fast food resturant, but it was the other way around? JVDS and NH on the beach. It goes bad, he calls papa. Papa gets him and takes him home and then calls Police cheif friend. They dispose of NH body in dumpster. PC friend drops off dad and he walks to fast food resturant. He calls JVDS to pick him up. In the process he wakes up JVDS from sleep at 3:30am. JVDS sees he has a text message from Kalpoe while on the way to pick up dad, responds that he got home alright. Picks up dad, returns home. PVDS tells him not to worry, that NH wasn't there, probably wandered off, will probably show at crack house. JVDS then tells dad that Kalpoe brothers were around. PVDS confers with Police Cheif friend and then changes story again and says lets get the boys together and make up story about Holiday Inn. Plan to frame secruity guards is hatched. Kalpoe brother calls DJ friend to back story up in case JVDS and dad double cross them.

BHT is worried that JVDS will be released on technicality. By goind with kidnap theory, they at least glean some justice.

BTW, reports of a ransom note are either not credible or perhaps someone trying to cash in on someone elses misery.

Also to those who say NH did run away. Balderdash! How could she have evaded Equusearch, the FBI, DEA, Dutch Marines, Sattelites, police, general public, etc.

Could it be that the US is somehow culpable? If we have a DEA agent deep in the police force and to compromise his/her position would ruin an investigation.

Also, has anyone heard that the Police Chief is now beginning to sweat? Are the Dutch going to replace him? Are they tired of the bad press and going to make some changes?

NO problem terp

Humor is always a good thing.

Is this true about the FBI now being in Alabama? Anybody from Alabama and close to the case here who can substantiate this claim?

Perfect, Phantom!

NO problem terp

Humor is always a good thing.

Is this true about the FBI now being in Alabama? Anybody from Alabama and close to the case here who can substantiate this claim?

THIS IS KIND OF DESCOURAGING IT Appeared in diario today, not confirmed it seems the FBI found a backbone in deep waters front the ligthhouse this happend on monday they do not know if the backbone is human they are checking

posting is becoming a trial in itself

Tanya
I think Natalee would be safer in MJ's hands, he's only interested in boys, rememeber?

well as long as we're quoting wouldn't the most appropriate be

"No Woman No Cry", Bob Marley

which was remixed by Paulus VDS feat Deepak, "No Body, No Crime""

This is spin control. There is no way that Joren is not responsible.

philo,

What info do you have that we others don't that leads you to this conclusion?

Maria said:

News on local radio noon in aruba
The FBI is questioning in Alabama the ex boyfriend and allso the girls that shared her room in aruba.
RADIO says in 72 hours they will solve the case with events no one expects.

Does anyone else think it is strange that this is only being reported in Aruba?

they found a backbone in deep waters in front of the ligthhouse on monday not confirmed if its human, diario today

People,
I am becoming very disappointed in you.

Some people, other than yoursevles, come to this blog to try and understand what is going on and maybe even believing some of what you say. And what is your response. Attitude. You are all caught up in a feeding fenzey and you have honestly lost sight of what was the original goal,
find Natalee and the real truth and go home. Yes there are some that come here to troll, and yes, there corrupt Arubans/Dutch authorites involved in this case. But please stand back and take a good close look at yourselves (I did). You are advocating a lot of stuff, I hope that won't end up in the long run to come back and haunt you. If these people don't agree with you, they are obviously Dutch and Aruban sympathizers who must be feed to the sharks. Your theories and your facts are not the only ones out there and stating them on this blog does not make them real fact.
Now this is the real Pea38. You can take this for what I intend it to be. Be careful, be cautious, be kind. Do not be judgemental, uncaring, and unaware into what you are doing. I am not innocent in some of this and I apologize for it.
Now I really don't care how any of you take these
comments and I really don't care because this will be my last comment on this blog and you can take that to the bank.

eep

I believe that horizonal 'V' means something along the lines of 'rock on','cool' or some such thing...it a 'teen' thing.

where are you hearing/finding info about and ex-boyfriend i cannot find it...

The 72 hour wait is on! What is M Croes the spokeswoman early on was a lover of PVDS. She the police cheif and PVDS tried to cover this whole thing up. Then we find Anita VDS is an aspiring actress and she reprised Shelly Winters roll as Manny's wife in the re-make of Poisiden Adventure. Poisident - ARuba 2005! Coming to a theater near you. We find that Juran is gay and could not have been making it with Natalee and that The Kalpoe brothers are actually guilty, but decided to frame Juran! Wow that would be unbelievable.

Folks if the ex boyfriend was involved, BHT would be on a plane back to Alabama to skin his hide! We have F-16's searching with IR camera's. How much more can we take? We need Columbo or Matlock on the case. Not Aruba keystone cops.

DISAPPOINTED ARUBIAN -

Three things...(1) Natalee only tried to "run away" from home...when she was a 2 or 3 years old toddler. Of course, she wasn't allowed to leave. (2) "Something bad happened to Natalee" on Aruba. (3) If everyone on Aruba knows so very well what each other is doing and what's happening, why do you claim ignorance of 17-year-old Joran's criminal activity, breaking Aruba law by drinking liquor and gambling, and why doesn't one of you who saw Natalee and Joran that fateful night come forward and tell what you know?

Just points of record.

I sent you a personal e-mail to the address you list. Please read it carefully. It's all true. And, yes, I do mean exactly what I say.

I pray God will help local native citizens of Aruba to have courage, to speak up, and to stand up for what's right.

And may God richly bless you and all of those with whom you share love, and may He always keep you safe!

- Thx,
DAN
Friend of Aruba & natural-born native Arubans

Sky that is VERY possible

Just so we get this straight about cooperation. The Twitty and Holloway and Reynolds families don't need photo-op searches of the countryside, or air show exercises with high-tech jets flying overhead. There is such a thing as cooperation, and there is such a thing as PR, and it ain't the same, folks. All they need is ONE person to step forward and tell them where to find Natalee.

The news of FBI talking in alabama to the exboyfriend and 2 roommates of miss holloway in the holiday inn info from radio radio in curacao and radio aruba, detail I do not have, imagin if this crime ends up in your own backyard.Are you guys prepared to mail all the letters of appology ?

BHT is right on to keep pressure on all suspects. I do see however, under her own legal counsel, I presume, she is changing tactics. Interviews BHT has given the last few days indicates they are going with the Kidnap theory. Mind you, they don't believe this, but with no body as PVDS says "no body, no crime" However if BHT lawyers charge kidnapping, they already have incriminating evidence such as lies by the Kalpoes, Lies by JVDS, the drugging of the drink, the confessions of "She kind of stumbling around at the beach" The confession of having sex, the comment "Something bad happened" I believe BHT has been informed by authorities that Natalee is probably dead, an no body will be recovered. So she has shifted gears onto the kidnapping theory in order to glean at least some justice. AFter all the boy admitted to being with her and then leaving her on the beach.

Now onto PVDS for a minute, has any one considered that he didn't pick up JVDS at 4am at the fast food resturant, but it was the other way around? JVDS and NH on the beach. It goes bad, he calls papa. Papa gets him and takes him home and then calls Police cheif friend. They dispose of NH body in dumpster. PC friend drops off dad and he walks to fast food resturant. He calls JVDS to pick him up. In the process he wakes up JVDS from sleep at 3:30am. JVDS sees he has a text message from Kalpoe while on the way to pick up dad, responds that he got home alright. Picks up dad, returns home. PVDS tells him not to worry, that NH wasn't there, probably wandered off, will probably show at crack house. JVDS then tells dad that Kalpoe brothers were around. PVDS confers with Police Cheif friend and then changes story again and says lets get the boys together and make up story about Holiday Inn. Plan to frame secruity guards is hatched. Kalpoe brother calls DJ friend to back story up in case JVDS and dad double cross them.

BHT is worried that JVDS will be released on technicality. By goind with kidnap theory, they at least glean some justice.

BTW, reports of a ransom note are either not credible or perhaps someone trying to cash in on someone elses misery.

Also to those who say NH did run away. Balderdash! How could she have evaded Equusearch, the FBI, DEA, Dutch Marines, Sattelites, police, general public, etc.

Could it be that the US is somehow culpable? If we have a DEA agent deep in the police force and to compromise his/her position would ruin an investigation.

Also, has anyone heard that the Police Chief is now beginning to sweat? Are the Dutch going to replace him? Are they tired of the bad press and going to make some changes?


Posted by: Skyboxx | July 7, 2005 02:05 PM

This is probably the most reasonable theory I have heard yet. THANK YOU

hardy and tina

That post went with an earlier post I had about an interview Greta did last week with the cell phone guy and hes said when he asked a group of boys who drove a silver car, they replied Joran. I thought that was strange that they thought the car was his and not the brothers.

"they found a backbone in deep waters in front of the ligthhouse on monday not confirmed if its human, diario today"

maria is this true or should i say confirmed? who is searching. do you actually see anything happening in the area where you are?

News on local radio noon in aruba
The FBI is questioning in Alabama the ex boyfriend and allso the girls that shared her room in aruba.
RADIO says in 72 hours they will solve the case with events no one expects

Maria, the FBI spoke to those people over a month ago. Do not believe the propaganda machine you call media in Aruba.
Despite the wishing of the dutchnationals in Aruba NO American will be arrested for Natalee's disappearance.

When it is proved that Aruban officials are corrupt will you apologize?

maria,
Do ya think that's why JVDS is STILL in jail?
Natalee's classmates were NOT the last ones seen with her, the Kalpoe's and JVDS were.

I am having one heck of a time posting today. Can you get Diario in English?

Someone posted earlier that Fox called Greta home from Aruba ASAP, is there any truth to this? Anyone? Anyone?

I am having one heck of a time posting today. Can you get Diario in English?

I am having one heck of a time posting today. Can you get Diario in English?

maria: do you use LSD often

Dan

1. I didn't know, I'm sorry. I was just stating the rumors I have heard and I did say I don't have reasons to believe rumors because that is what they are, just rumors.

2. We can all agree on that.

3.Trust me, if I had anything on him it'd be all over the street like 50 cent.
Other, I don't know if anyone knows anything. If someone did, it's strange that it's not out because one thing I can tell you about Arubians (--F-16's again--), they cannot keep a secret, they love to talk and they usually do. So I wouldn't know much about this, or if it even involves an Arubian having the key to the case.

Maria--- apologize????? Even if this were to turn out that a classmate was involved it doesn't excuse the incompetence of the law enforcement that failed to do routine investigations, thus exposing the blatant corruption that rules this Dutch controlled land. If the investigation had been even 1/3 as concerned with the boys as they were with the 2 security guards then there would be some answers in this case by now. Bottom line is you have corrupt LE and government and they will not let the truth come out.

Maria, the FBI spoke to those people over a month ago. Do not believe the propaganda machine you call media in Aruba?

Did they threaten your family? Your tone has changed significantly.

Skyboxx,

I have one problem with your scenario. If the police chief is such a good friend to help PVDS to get rid of a body, why isn't he that good of a friend to give PVDS a ride home? I mean it's not THAT far, a mile or two at the most.

I really do not care the nationality of the criminal that harmed Natalee I just want the truth to como out no matter what and they do time

PHILO -

The possible scenario that you mention does happen occasionally, and the U-S CIA, DEA, FBI, State Department and others know it.

Some of us are already doing both things that you suggest. And you are right. It's a lifelong struggle.

But we must keep on keepin' on!

Any and all help will be very much appreciated.

Phantom-
I had to distance myself from the problem, and not really just believe what I wanted to believe. I had to painfully listen to what some of those who were named "trolls" were saying and I had to divorce myslef from my own little world. I learned a lot. I do this for a "living"-I have to be able to think critically and scientifically at things.

I started from one of my early theories, yes. Then I listened to what others had to say. I watched the way BHT was behaving. I saw what the authorities were doing. I learned about Aruba, its connection with Holland. I saw why the LE did what they did. Once I put it all together, it became so very very clear. It just took me too long, though.

My lesson to myself and from all you here: Thank you for helping me to look "beyond", difficult as it is. I hate what I've seen, but all along I knew it was out there. It just never "touched" me before like this. I am totally wrenched with this event. I cannot even imagine what BHT feels like. She knows it too, she has all along.

The saving grace is that there are folks like you and so many here (me too) that are not a part of that world.

Dan

1. I didn't know, I'm sorry. I was just stating the rumors I have heard and I did say I don't have reasons to believe rumors because that is what they are, just rumors.

2. We can all agree on that.

3.Trust me, if I had anything on him it'd be all over the street like 50 cent.
Other, I don't know if anyone knows anything. If someone did, it's strange that it's not out because one thing I can tell you about Arubians (--F-16's again--), they cannot keep a secret, they love to talk and they usually do. So I wouldn't know much about this, or if it even involves an Arubian having the key to the case.

The news of FBI talking in alabama to the exboyfriend and 2 roommates of miss holloway in the holiday inn info from radio radio in curacao and radio aruba, detail I do not have, imagin if this crime ends up in your own backyard.Are you guys prepared to mail all the letters of appology ?

----------------

If it gave Beth answers, I would happily write letters of apology. But I know this report is more local rubish, a little tit-for-tat.

Yes, Dave. Greta wrote that herself. Hse believes it has to do with the turn of events in London and has nothing to do with the events in Aruba. Sad that she is being pulled from there. That is another "friend" gone from the life of BHT.

I apologize if some of my comments have been over the top. But I cannot believe that nobody on the island knows where Natalee is. And that fact alone, along with the presence of known predators on the island, makes Aruba an unacceptable risk for any American tourist. I would never, ever, want to send another young girl into that environment. And if the Dutch think it's so safe, let them send THEIR daughters to Carlos and Charlies and then wait by the phone for the bad news.

Dan

1. I didn't know, I'm sorry. I was just stating the rumors I have heard and I did say I don't have reasons to believe rumors because that is what they are, just rumors.

2. We can all agree on that.

3.Trust me, if I had anything on him it'd be all over the street like 50 cent.
Other, I don't know if anyone knows anything. If someone did, it's strange that it's not out because one thing I can tell you about Arubians (--F-16's again--), they cannot keep a secret, they love to talk and they usually do. So I wouldn't know much about this, or if it even involves an Arubian having the key to the case.

maria: do you use LSD often

Posted by: bobup | July 7, 2005 02:30 PM

Hey bobup, Be nicer to maria, she was upfront and honet until she vanished a couple days ago. Now she is back and spewing the partyline so I suspect that her family has been threatened. She must be terrified. She really need to contact Beth or an FBI agant on the island and seek safe haven from the terrorists running roughshod over that tiny island.

Dave

Greta posted on her website that she has been called back to report on the London event.

hey don't pick on maria. she is only telling us what she heard on the radio. she has given us updates many times before.

Dave,

Foxnews website does confirm that Greta was called back to the states as a result of the terror attack in London.

Well it seems Greta is on her way to Washington. On Fox.com it says she thinks its because of the London bombings. I searched for any word about NH, but only found it at the bottom of the page and it was merely Gretas blog.

Out of all the bizarre events that have happened in this case so far, the most bizarre and what truly has everybody grasping at straws is the fact that NO evidence has been found, none, zilch, nada, or so, as far as we know. It is as if Natalee simply vanished into thin air. I'll tell you something, I am a father of two girls and I pray to God that I never have to go through what this poor family is going through; you raise your kids with all the love and care in the world to have some gutter-dwelling disease that is a poor excuse for a human take that life away or ruin it forever. There has got to be justice somewhere, even with all the evil, violence and hatred in this world and I know God is too loving to let this just go the way it has so far for much longer...we must all have faith that Natalee and her family will have peace, be it here on this planet we ALL share or in the after life...WOW, sorry, but I had to vent there, this is really really frustrating.

According to Greta's blog she was called home and is leaving Aruba, she doesn't know where she is going but she is leavin Aruba

Well it seems Greta is on her way to Washington. On Fox.com it says she thinks its because of the London bombings. I searched for any word about NH, but only found it at the bottom of the page and it was merely Gretas blog.

I DO NOT KNOW THE FACTS< BUT ASK ANY FBI when there someone missing they allways check out the parents and people around the victim, it is standard they look first to the parents , husbands

Skyboxx

My first thought after reading your theory was...Yeah but they would have found the body in the dumpster. But, after I thought about it I think I recall reading (maybe on this blog) that there is an incinerator on the island. Does anyone know if all trash is brought there?

It's ironic that a few weeks back we probably would have asked what you were smoking!!! But now, I just don't think that there is much of anything that we can discount 100%!

According to Greta's blog she was called home and is leaving Aruba, she doesn't know where she is going but she is leavin Aruba

Well I emailed Fox and told them that can should keep Greta in Aruba. They have more than enough reporters to cover stories.

Yes they do Maria, they check them first. The roommates, chaperones, etc.. were all cleared over a month ago by the FBI while the Aruban polis were covering for Joran.

News on local radio noon in aruba
The FBI is questioning in Alabama the ex boyfriend and allso the girls that shared her room in aruba.
RADIO says in 72 hours they will solve the case with events no one expects.

posted by Maria July 7, 2005

Are you sure this radio broadcast is about the Natalee Holloway missing Alabama girl and not the missing Alabama woman nurse from the same town as Natalee?

Are you all as worried as I am, that without Greta, this could fall out of the spotlight? What can we do?

No one is so called picking on her..she asked if we would apologize if one of Natalee's friends harmed her.

Cindy i have read in earlier post that their is one incenerator on the island and it runs 24 hours a day

Well I emailed Fox and told them that can should keep Greta in Aruba. They have more than enough reporters to cover stories.

Viewerservices@foxnews.com

FOXaroundtheworld@foxnews.com (non-U.S. viewers only).

letfreedomring, Jaxbelle, SS, Atljoie, Moonshadow

Thanks for the answer. Been following the case close but I missed that. Its that pesky working for a living thing that made me miss it! LOL
Im afraid that her leaving is really going to hurt BHT's cause!

Maria yes that is the standard procedure over here in canada too. I believe they are just getting facts straight for the aruban police. maybe they are ready now to convict someone but I would not put your hope on it being one of the schoolmates. they reason for this is that they did not have the means to get rid of the body. they body would have been found. maybe joran has confessed finally or maybe they have the body and have had it a long time and that is why they did not allow the search teams to do more.

Anybody know what make, type and color of the car/suv that the police chief drives? Could it be a white Suzuki?

I agree, Jax. Greta was the only person gettin' er done.

Maybe Geraldo will take her place?!

Hopper - any response from Fox? How about any of the senators? I have gotten no response from anyone that I have snail mailed or emailed and there have been quite a few. A little disappointed but as long as they are putting pressure where it should be.....

Last night was the first night I had nightmares about Natalee. I can only begin to imagine what her family is going through.

Starting storm prep in case Dennis decides to "jog" our way.

Jaxbelle

I totally agree, thats the first thing I thought of when I heard that.

Jaxbelle,

It will only fall out of the spotlight if we let it. If you read the letter I composed to send to your representatives and senators, you'll see that even thought finding Natalee is our number one objective, there will be continued danger from Aruba until we focus our own Gov't on the corruption. And corruption funds terrorism.
They can't ignore our concerns, if they do, there wil be more Natalees...continued corruption, money laundering, and yes, terrorist funding. But we have to take action instead of just vent our frustration. If enough of us put together a true grassroots letter writing campaign, we could get our own media attention.

maria: do you use LSD often

Posted by: bobup | July 7, 2005 02:30 PM


Hey bobup, Be nicer to maria, she was upfront and honet until she vanished a couple days ago. Now she is back and spewing the partyline so I suspect that her family has been threatened. She must be terrified. She really need to contact Beth or an FBI agant on the island and seek safe haven from the terrorists running roughshod over that tiny island.

Skyboxx,
If I read your theory a few weeks back I would have asked what you were smoking, but not now!

My first thought was "yeah but what about the body in the dumpster, surely it would have been found." Then I remembered reading ((here I think) that there is an incinerator on the island. Does anyone know if all trash ends up there?

Pantom-
I would guess that he didn't take him directly home for fear that someone might see his car at the VDS home.

Everyone needs to email foxnews NOW

I emailed Fox and told them that can should keep Greta in Aruba. They have more than enough reporters to cover stories.

Viewerservices@foxnews.com

FOXaroundtheworld@foxnews.com (non-U.S. viewers only).

i cannot find anything about this ex-boyfriend stuff even on aruba today.. where are you hearing this

I cannot believe that Fox called Greta to come back to the states. She is the one keeping this story alive. She's the one reporter who has no qualms about knocking on doors in order to talk to the Kalpos, the VDS's, the police. arggggggggg Her leaving the island is not a good thing.

You guys I just report what I hear and read here in Aruba,I do not want a specific resolution to this case I want the truth period the truth does not harm it sets you free, I personaly think those boys are guilty, but you know I AM AFRAID OF PREJUgDing when I do not have all the facts.
Here in Aruba we have a saying do not spit in the air because it will fall on your face, and live tends to give you surprises you did not expect.
incompetent without resources is one thing corrupt is something totally different, we will see what is the outcome

sorry maria

Hey, PHILO -

If Greta is indeed being dispatched by FOX News to Washington, D.C, and Beth were to head there, too, your theory could be closer to right than anyone guesses.

But it's difficult to work in Colombia, much easier in Venezuela.

I don't expect that's what Greta's assigment is about...but we'll soon know.

Maybe a U. S. Senate Committee wants to talk with her about Aruba. ;)

* * * * * * *

A very serious question for anyone on Aruba, the Netherlands Antilles or Colombia to answer: WHERE is Joran's well-dressed Bogota, Colombia, buddy Jaime?

I would very much appreciate a verifiable answer from someone who knows.

Thank you.

Island Hopper. Just wanted to let you know that I emailed fox news to keep Greta in Aruba! Hope that take it into consideration.

I cannot believe that Fox called Greta to come back to the states. She is the one keeping this story alive. She's the one reporter who has no qualms about knocking on doors in order to talk to the Kalpos, the VDS's, the police. arggggggggg Her leaving the island is not a good thing.

Posted by: Gale | July 7, 2005 03:07 PM

Everyone needs to email foxnews NOW

I emailed Fox and told them that can should keep Greta in Aruba. They have more than enough reporters to cover stories.

Viewerservices@foxnews.com

FOXaroundtheworld@foxnews.com (non-U.S. viewers only).

I would guess that he didn't take him directly home for fear that someone might see his car at the VDS home.

Posted by: CindyLou Who | July 7, 2005 03:04 PM

But in Skyboxxs scenario the police chief had already picked up PVDS as his home on the way to dispose of the body, so what's the difference.

Why isn't the GREAT kingdom of dutchies at the GREAT 8 Summit? oh is it that they are NOT so GREAT?

Jaxbelle

As far as us doing something? I think we should all send emails to Fox requesting that Greta goes back to Aruba. Viewer ratings and wants are king in this industry! You would be surprised how well this works.

hardy and tina

That post went with an earlier post I had about an interview Greta did last week with the cell phone guy and hes said when he asked a group of boys who drove a silver car, they replied Joran. I thought that was strange that they thought the car was his and not the brothers.

Posted by: concerned American mom and teacher | July 7, 2005 02:23 PM
------------------------------------------

You can take what he says two ways. He is not clear. He makes it seem as though the car =joran, I know. But I don't think that is how he wanted to actually present it. He has two bits of info.. Tall white young guy and silver matallic car. I think they recognized tall white young guy...more than the car. YES, they do relate Joran with that car, okay, I can go with that. (haha, I'm too lazy to go back and find it again. I thought just like you, but after watching it a few times I started to realize that Croes is not very good at presenting what actually happened.)
Originally I imagined that while Deepak was at work Satish and Joran would sneak out and about with his car and people got to associate him with the car. Could be.

I just emailed Fox as well and told them to send Greta back!!!! :)

AtlJoie
yup! lots of problems posting

I would guess that he didn't take him directly home for fear that someone might see his car at the VDS home.

Posted by: CindyLou Who | July 7, 2005 03:04 PM

But in Skyboxxs scenario the police chief had already picked up PVDS as his home on the way to dispose of the body, so what's the difference.

Maybe Jan was busy figuring out who to finger for the crime.

does anyone know if they have searched other islands ? Their are a lot of scenarios with her being sold into slavery or to a drug cartel in Curacao or Venezula (sp) ?

Phantom,

Do you really think the police cheif would want to risk being seen with PVDS at his home the same night a girl PVDS son was seen with and no police report was filed??? C'mon. They were going to let two guards swing for this. They invented upteem lies to cover their tracks...Innocent people don't do this. Guilty people invent stories....Wake up and smell the Arubuian Coffee man........

Oh, man....Dennis Dennis Go Away...Hopper, did you see the latest hurrican path projection?

Fox just announced that Greta would be LIVE in Washington tonight to report on the London bombings.

We have lost her!!!!!!!

Thanks for all that email Fox keep up the good work.

We can only hope that Beth is on her way to WDC with Greta and the entire Holloway and Twitty Families left the dutch penal colony AKA aruba.

Those stupid dutchies DO NOT want me to come down there and take Greta's place.

a
Agree and had forgot he said tall white guy till you mentioned it.

I would guess that he didn't take him directly home for fear that someone might see his car at the VDS home.

Posted by: CindyLou Who | July 7, 2005 03:04 PM

But in Skyboxxs scenario the police chief had already picked up PVDS as his home on the way to dispose of the body, so what's the difference.

Maybe Jan was busy figuring out who to finger for the crime.

Gretta to go DC

Could it be because the public is getting SICK of her busting her way into innocent peoples homes, shoving a microphone in their faces and trying to get them arrested? Beth to follow her, LOL....the public is even more sick of her, she is the Neo Schiavo Mom.

IHOP

i wrote you back over there. must go do a lot of reading. latest is 50 dead

latest suicide bomber in attack was just released from gitmo.

on the line w/ london now.

PHANOTOM

i am so glad you are still with us!! I was worried about you last night. please read what i wrote to you earlier on this thread!!

please stay with us.

talk with you all later

Yeah right. This story has been around for a while now, especially the part that says "case will be solved with events no one expects". Total hogwash story.

For the sake of argument, even if a MB kid was involved, they must of had a lot of help from on the island. I don't see a tourist pulling off such a disappearance on their own.

icey


>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
News on local radio noon in aruba
The FBI is questioning in Alabama the ex boyfriend and allso the girls that shared her room in aruba.
RADIO says in 72 hours they will solve the case
with events no one expects.

posted by Maria July 7, 2005

Are you sure this radio broadcast is about the Natalee Holloway missing Alabama girl and not the missing Alabama woman nurse from the same town as Natalee?

Yeah right. This story has been around for a while now, especially the part that says "case will be solved with events no one expects". Total hogwash story.

For the sake of argument, even if a MB kid was involved, they must of had a lot of help from on the island. I don't see a tourist pulling off such a disappearance on their own.

icey


>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
News on local radio noon in aruba
The FBI is questioning in Alabama the ex boyfriend and allso the girls that shared her room in aruba.
RADIO says in 72 hours they will solve the case
with events no one expects.

posted by Maria July 7, 2005

Are you sure this radio broadcast is about the Natalee Holloway missing Alabama girl and not the missing Alabama woman nurse from the same town as Natalee?

Someone with access to SM should post something there to get all of them to email Fox about getting Greta back to Aruba.

I have emailed two to Fox and one to Greta herself!

comments@foxnews.com
viewerservices@foxnews.com
ontherecord@foxnews.com

I am not worried that the press (media) is going away. Only if they are quiet, can a "deal" be made to get the remains of NH, if there are any.

IMO, Skyboxx, BHT has not shifted. She has always known and asked for NH back from thedrug lords. JVDS did not "harm" NH. He simply delivered her, on the beach, as planned.

BHT cannot continue to pressure the authorities. She can only go to the head of the Police and ask that some arrangement be made for her to somehow get NH's remains, if they still exist. are any.

There was no dumping of NH in any dumpster and nothing so seemingly trite. That's why she "vanished" - right into the hands of "dirty hand" as Shango says.

After BHT is back in Mt. Brook, she can decide what to do about what she now knows about Aruban organized crime. If she makes her "announcement" she'll only shock types like Mountain Brook citizens and those others who don't want to acknowledge the existence of the dirty underbelly of corrupted people.The "U.S." already knows about these things.

BOBUP

if you are here read up on london attack thread

Yeah right. This story has been around for a while now, especially the part that says "case will be solved with events no one expects". Total hogwash story.

For the sake of argument, even if a MB kid was involved, they must of had a lot of help from on the island. I don't see a tourist pulling off such a disappearance on their own.

icey


>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
News on local radio noon in aruba
The FBI is questioning in Alabama the ex boyfriend and allso the girls that shared her room in aruba.
RADIO says in 72 hours they will solve the case
with events no one expects.

posted by Maria July 7, 2005

Are you sure this radio broadcast is about the Natalee Holloway missing Alabama girl and not the missing Alabama woman nurse from the same town as Natalee?

I just finished emailing Fox requesting Greta stay in Aruba as well. Remember there is power in numbers!

Yeah right. This story has been around for a while now, especially the part that says "case will be solved with events no one expects". Total hogwash story.

For the sake of argument, even if a MB kid was involved, they must of had a lot of help from on the island. I don't see a tourist pulling off such a disappearance on their own.

icey


>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
News on local radio noon in aruba
The FBI is questioning in Alabama the ex boyfriend and allso the girls that shared her room in aruba.
RADIO says in 72 hours they will solve the case
with events no one expects.

posted by Maria July 7, 2005

Are you sure this radio broadcast is about the Natalee Holloway missing Alabama girl and not the missing Alabama woman nurse from the same town as Natalee?

Here is a link posted at SM: It's from the National Enquirer so make of it what you will.

Read it all here:

http://www.nationalenquirer.com/crime/63309

I am closing my hurrican shutters today when I get home.

mooonshadow,
yes I saw it, Thank goodness this house is sold and the boat is in drydock!

My oldest boy just called to make sure I was OK. He is too funny. I have no fear, hurricanes, terrorists, dutchies, etc... nothing bothers me anymore.

http://www.cnn.com/SPECIALS/2005/hurricanes/

This is the link on CNN - click on "Projected Path", this is the 11:00 a.m. advisory

Moonshadow, I finally got around to sending out your letter via email to both of my senators and my congressman. As I was cutting and pasting, it almost brought tears to my eyes to see how much effort and skill went into that letter. God bless you.

Now, remember. 3 phone calls to travel agents. It shouldn't take much time, and they will be hungry for information from Aruba, since it is their business to be "in the know." Just be factual and objective, and leave your number with them, in case they have any more questions.

Skyboxx,

I'm only commenting on what you wrote in your post @ 2:05pm.

Either the police chief picks up PVDS at his home on the way to dispose of the body

or

PVDS meets the police chief at the beach after returning from taking JVDS home. Did PVDS walk back to the beach or did he drive back?

If he drove back he (PVDS) doesn't need to call JVDS at home to come pick him up.

Which is it? Can't have it both ways.

Is anybody sure the body was disposed of that night? Many many people have told me that they just think it was in that house and was the reason PVDS cooked up the wild goose chase to the casino with the H-T entourage.

Greta will be back but we must keep the pressure on for her to return promptly. And tomorrow is when Joran may walk??

IT would be in keeping with Joran's bragging pattern for him to tell people that Deepak's care was him own. And it is only Mama Sloot who says they were not very good friends. The photos at the websites say otherwise. Maybe just seeing him in it so much and his being the white guy, racist that they all seem to be, they took it for granted the white guy owned the car.

In and out today but tryint to follow story.

I should ask you to ask fox and cnn to send reporters when the trail starts, soo we get a detail inform of all the facts the DA presents,
hope fox and cnn do not loose interest if the raitings drop, they are on this story just for the ratings. Its just business for them.
biggest victim is poor natalee after that is her family and the honest and hard working people of aruba are allso victims of the inscropulus acts of these criminals.NORMAl decent citizens do not doubt the justice system, because we have no reasons to doubt them, offcorse anything is possible and if it is I would want it to come out.
After this is over Im shure they are going to investigate the faults or corruption that ocuured during this investigation.

BOBUP

if you are here read up on london attack thread

Maria yes that is the standard procedure over here in canada too. I believe they are just getting facts straight for the aruban police. maybe they are ready now to convict someone but I would not put your hope on it being one of the schoolmates. they reason for this is that they did not have the means to get rid of the body. they body would have been found. maybe joran has confessed finally or maybe they have the body and have had it a long time and that is why they did not allow the search teams to do more.

Maria----I completely understand your position and respect it. The incompetence of the police may be justifiable or may have been coordinated due to the corruption in the govt. If they had done their jobs on May 30 we would know what happened, PERIOD. They gave the perpetrators time to get rid of all evidence, whether it was due to incompetence or corruption. I hope the truth comes out so the Holloways and the Aruban citizens can be released as the hostages they have become in this situation. God Bless all innocent parties in this tragedy, they are as much victims in this as Natalee herself.

Send letters to all elected officials even those in state govt. They may reply that this is a federal issue, by I respond that I would like to see my state officials request help too. They should have a little more pull than a regular US citizen.

What we are setting up here is a network of elected officials that we can mobilize if this case goes unsolved, and all suspects walk.

icey

Island Hopper

You said nothing bothers you anymore, What about Aruban police investigators??? LOL

Hi Phantom

Skyboxx said:
"Papa gets him and takes him home and then calls Police cheif friend. They dispose of NH body in dumpster. PC friend drops off dad and he walks to fast food resturant".

I assumed from Skyboxx that PVDS didn't have a car and probably met the PC somewhere and then went to body...
Skyboxx???

Anyway IMO a great theory. From what I have concluded from reading about PVDS he's pretty knowledgeable about legal loopholes and would have done everything in his power so as to not implicate himself while helping Joran.


Thanks, Professor. I do think if enough of those types of letters are sent to the right people, we will hear back. Not today, I'm sure. They all have their hands full with the elevated Terror alert. All we need is ONE representative or ONE senator who feels as passionately about this issue as we do, and then the ball really gets rolling.

joran or anyother vds will never confess.. they can't they would screw themselves after the whole judicial system has created this coverup. Does anyone know anything about the appeal Joran's attorneys filed or the ones the Prosecture filed regarding the release of the Kalpoe brothers ?

Nothing scares me sorry.

Reality check, Folks.

As a 44-year metro radio, television and newspaper personality, executive and owner, I can tell you we found listener, viewer and reader calls and mail interesting and sometimes entertaining, but we didn't concern ourselves with reacting to the calls or mail in any kind of way unless we received several thousand of them saying the same thing in relation to the same subject.

We sure didn't make prograaming and assigment decisions based upon callers' or letter writers' opinions.

And FOX doesn't either.

Sorry.

Hey with the elevated terror alert people can get their deposit back on ANY planned trip to Aruba!!!!!!!!!

So let's look at the good news that came out of the tragedy this morning.

you guys i have to go , if fox leaves maria will keep you info from aruba see you tomorrow with arubas headlines

joran or anyother vds will never confess.. they can't they would screw themselves after the whole judicial system has created this coverup. Does anyone know anything about the appeal Joran's attorneys filed or the ones the Prosecture filed regarding the release of the Kalpoe brothers ?

CindyLouWho,

The night of May 30th, the night that Natalee went missing, PVDS had at least 2 cars at his disposal.

My last post was worded poorly.

I know PVDS has a car, just that he didn't use it to meet up with the PC.

I'm feeling very guilty these days. When I heard about the London bombings this morning my very first thought was "oh no this is going to take away from NH news coverage", not about the people in London. Anytime there are new headlines I think of poor BHT, and her fight to keep Natalee's disappearance in the spotlight.
Fox has had very little NH coverage today and now I read here that Greta is leaving Aruba....

I do know how to turn FOX news OFF.

At this point our only hope is that Joran gets a visit from one of those hard-working Aruban businessmen who sweated and starved their children to build some business that they could pass on, while Joran had everything handed to him.
And maybe, just maybe, when they lay it all out to him, and explain what unhappy campers they'd be if a boycott occurred, then maybe 12-20 years in prison would start to look a lot more attractive to Joran. At least, he'd have all his body parts.

Did Shepard Smith even mention NH????

Did Shepard Smith even mention NH????

Thanks as always, Maria.

I cannot believe that Fox called Greta to come back to the states. She is the one keeping this story alive. She's the one reporter who has no qualms about knocking on doors in order to talk to the Kalpos, the VDS's, the police. arggggggggg Her leaving the island is not a good thing.

Posted by: Gale | July 7, 2005 03:07 PM

Everyone needs to email foxnews NOW

I emailed Fox and told them that can should keep Greta in Aruba. They have more than enough reporters to cover stories.

NOTE: I DO KNOW HOW TO TURN FOX NEWS OFF and will.


Viewerservices@foxnews.com
FOXaroundtheworld@foxnews.com (non-U.S. viewers only).

I somehow think that the body has already been discovered but is being covered up. Why would the reports earlier in the investigation say a body had been discovered, an abandoned bloody mattress, blood in the kalpoe car, as well as a confession of "something bad happened". All this was later retracted. I think this is really fishy.

Did Shepard Smith even mention NH????

Did Shepard Smith even mention NH????

Did Shepard Smith even mention NH????

Natalee did not necessarily have to be
dead or disposed of that Sunday night, did she?

She could have been kept somewhere as her mom suggested in one interview (I believe she is being moved from house to house). And later died, as I don't believe she is still alive now.

I somehow think that the body has already been discovered but is being covered up. Why would the reports earlier in the investigation say a body had been discovered, an abandoned bloody mattress, blood in the kalpoe car, as well as a confession of "something bad happened". All this was later retracted. I think this is really fishy.

I somehow think that the body has already been discovered but is being covered up. Why would the reports earlier in the investigation say a body had been discovered, an abandoned bloody mattress, blood in the kalpoe car, as well as a confession of "something bad happened". All this was later retracted. I think this is really fishy.

Hi
I posted a few times early June to get a feeling for what the general consensus was concerning the level of PVDS involvement. I see the post from skyboxx which is in line with where my head was early June. Can someone give me a ballpark guestimate % of people who post here who would agree that his level of involvemnt is in line with scenario presented by skyboxx.

Also I can imagine that PVDS would call upon a friend or relative. What is your clue skyboxx that the police chief was that person?

-Jane

Thanks for the email addresses Island Hopper. I shouldn't complain unless I plan to do something about it. I will email them (FOX)right now. Hopefully that won't take me as long as it takes to post on this site.

Professor:

If in my hands, Joran could kiss his limbs goodbye.
If anything should happen to Aruba, only the hardworking Aruban citizens will suffer while those on the top will be living large because of their 'connections'.
If Americans boycott Aruba, the criminals won't suffer, the innocent Arubians will. So boycott makes no sense if you really think about it.

is this site dead?

The only way a threat of a boycott would be successful in applying leverage would be if we could start it AND stop it. Unfortunately, this whole backlash could take on a life of its own and become unstoppable. With each passing day, the Aruban government seems to find new ways to shoot itself in the foot. If there are no surprises, look for tourist revenues to be off 50 percent by this time next year, and look for tourism-related commercial property values to be off at minimum 23 percent by this time next year. And that would be WITHOUT a formal boycott of the island. Just self-inflicted bad PR.

Greta is leaving Aruba. I hate to hear it but am not surprised - lately her interview subjects have been refusing to answer questions. Interviews have become stale. Greta is not kind of person to be confrontational with people, failing to ask the police investigator about his frienship with the Van Der Sloops. And, the people in Aruba are such liars that even when they answer questions you don't know if it's accurate information. I'm thinking about the DJ saying he didn't know Joren when there is a photograph of the two together.

Anyway, how many examples do you need that the Dutch legal system is corrupt? Anybody that doesn't know that by now will never be convinced.

This is my third and last request on this site for an answer to this simple but important question.

WHERE IS JORAN'S FRIEND JAIME?

Does anyone on Aruba, in the Netherlands Antilles, Venezuela or Colombia know where Jaime, Joran van der Sloot's well-dressed buddy from Bogota, Colombia, is right now?

If anyone knows, please tell me.

Thank you.

UGA SUX!!!! YES IT DOES. SURE DOES.
ATHENS SUX TOO.

Fox kept the NH story alive, which is what BT wanted. Apparently there hasn't been many other big stories lately. Today though, there is. I think the NH case is going on the backburner.

Fox kept the NH story alive, which is what BT wanted. Apparently there hasn't been many other big stories lately. Today though, there is. I think the NH case is going on the backburner.

is this site dead?
_______________________
I'm having trouble getting the site to work. Posts seem to disappear and maybe appear later. It is getting to be too much to mess with.

yellah fellah needs to gets himself a reel job n stop shinin masssah's shoes

boo hoo did the little professor blow snot bubbles while he weeped

yellah fellah needs to gets himself a reel job n stop shinin masssah's shoes

boo hoo did the little professor blow snot bubbles while he weeped

I give up trying to post here. Something is really wrong and I don't know how to fix it.

Fox has been keeping the NH story alive, which is what BT wanted. With the London bombings the NH story is going on the backburner.

I give up trying to post here. Something is really wrong and I don't know how to fix it.

Fox has been keeping the NH story alive, which is what BT wanted. With the London bombings the NH story is going on the backburner.

I have also emailed FOXNEWS. What are they thinking? They have plenty of reporters to cover London. I don't think this has anything to do with London. Thoughts?

A good piece of news today but it does not concern Natalee:
http://www.sptimes.com/2005/07/07/Pasco/Teen__missing_since_S.shtml (this girl needs some serious counseling)

I give up trying to post here. Something is really wrong and I don't know how to fix it.

Fox has been keeping the NH story alive, which is what BT wanted. With the London bombings the NH story is going on the backburner.

Jane,
I had the same feelings a long time ago too. I've never understood why the 3 boys didn't crack. I'm not even convinced that JVDS or the Kalpoes know the whole story but DADDY does. The polis chief is up to his ears in it too.

I give up trying to post here. Something is really wrong and I don't know how to fix it.

Fox has been keeping the NH story alive, which is what BT wanted. With the London bombings the NH story is going on the backburner.

Able,
Maybe someone on Aruba could inquire as to where Jamie might be. I don't have a clue and am not sure which one he is for thought he was the real young one that sometimes wears a baseball cap, not well dressed.

So anyone on the ground in Aruba know where Jamie from Columbia is?

Do media not pay any attention to thousands and thousands of letters requesting something like Greta going back? Others can cover this tragedy in London, she should be in bad compassion shortage mode about now anyway.

But it is the Arubans who should not want the media to go away NOW and leave this with egg all over their faces. They should want to get a much better face than this on things before the media leaves for otherwise, the image will forever be stuck at this phase with it looking for all the world like not only a cover up but a bungling and obvious one.

Jojo
hope4natalee
seedyrum
--------------

RE: "white Suzuki on the beach"

is NOT the same as the two cars towed from Van Der Sloot's home on June 15. This is contrary to CNN's misleading story yesterday, July 5.
(see below: "new information ")

I know many of you may have resolved this but I could not find it until I searched news stories - so I appologize for the redundancy but it was very frustrating that CNN led me on a wild goose chase yesterday! So I just wanted to share what I found because several were discussing this last night.

DAVID MATTINGLY, CNN CORRESPONDENT gave incorrect information. I wish these people would double check.
=====================================

From Kalpoe's atty as stated in this transcript of

Nancy Grace for July 5, 2005, CNNHN

Aired July 5, 2005 - 20:00:00 ET

The entire transcript is at: (Scroll down to second half
@ "DAVID MATTINGLY, CNN CORRESPONDENT"

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0507/05/ng.01.html

Lisa Pinto, "But first, let`s go to CNN correspondent Dave Mattingly"

DAVID MATTINGLY, CNN CORRESPONDENT: "Well, earlier tonight, just a couple of hours ago, some
new information
coming to us in this case. Defense attorneys for the Kalpoe brothers confirmed to CNN that fishermen - - Aruban fishermen have told investigators that they did not see a couple matching the description of Natalee Holloway and Joran Van Der Sloot on the beach the night that Natalee was reported missing.

What they did see, however, was a
WHITE Suzuki on the beach.

If you remember, a WHITE Suzuki

was one of the vehicles confiscated during a search of the Van Der Sloot home.

This new information

might have been responsible in part for the judge`s decision to keep Van Der Sloot in jail for another 60 days for questioning in this case. We don`t know if it had any bearing on his decision to release the Kalpoe brothers."

============================================

My question was, "What was the car towed from VDS home?
Where can I find this info?........

I found out that IT WAS NOT A WHITE vehicle towed from VDS home...

One was RED ...
One was BLUE ...

(see below for sources and statements)
-------------------------------------------
http://www.cnn.com/2005/LAW/06/15/missing.teen/index.html

Wednesday, June 15, 2005 Posted: 7:57 PM EDT (2357 GMT)

Joran Van Der Sloot, whose home was searched Wednesday.

ORANJESTAD, Aruba (CNN) -- Authorities searched the home Wednesday of a 17-year-old detained in connection with the disappearance of an Alabama teenager more than two weeks ago. Trapenberg said he did not know what prompted the search. "People have gone over the area [before] but not as intensely as this time," he said.
=============================================


http://channels.attbusiness.net/index.cfm?fuseAction=viewNewsArticle&nav_id=33&category_name=International&article_id=96dae3ccbe53c43da08aa4d32567e67e

Investigators led a massive and fruitless search of Malmok beach June 14.

Only the following day, 16 days after Holloway went missing, did investigators search the van der Sloot house, seizing two vehicles, computers and cameras.
=============================================

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,159730,00.html
(scroll down to: "House Searched")

...
House Searched ---

Two white-uniformed investigators from Holland walked through the Van Der Sloot family's one-story, yellow-beige home Wednesday, while others guarded the entranceway.

A BLUE sport utility vehicle and
a RED Jeep were also towed from the property, which includes an attached apartment where the young man lives...

Attorney General Karin Janssen ... went into the house with investigators Wednesday,

FBI (search) agents and officers from the Miami-Dade police department brought two bloodhounds to help search that area of tropical vegetation next to the Marriott Hotel, and firefighters pumped water from the site. They gave up their search by nightfall.

===============================================
http://www.decaturdaily.com/decaturdaily/news/050616/dutch.shtml

On Tuesday, FBI agents and officers from the Miami-Dade police department used German Shepherds to search a beachside mangrove swamp next to the Marriott Hotel after a former detainee in the case said the three young men may have lied to police about where they took Holloway. The area, known as Malmok beach, is a popular nighttime spot for lovers.

...
Towed vehicles ---

Authorities towed

a BLUE sport utility vehicle and
a RED Jeep away from the house, which is

surrounded by a low stone wall and fronted by an expanse of trees and cacti.

Posted by: AkekoaHoAlethia | July 6, 2005 03:58 PM

I have also emailed FOXNEWS. What are they thinking? They have plenty of reporters to cover London. I don't think this has anything to do with London. Thoughts?

A good piece of news today but it does not concern Natalee:
http://www.sptimes.com/2005/07/07/Pasco/Teen__missing_since_S.shtml (this girl needs some serious counseling)

Jane,
I had the same feelings a long time ago too. I've never understood why the 3 boys didn't crack. I'm not even convinced that JVDS or the Kalpoes know the whole story but DADDY does. The polis chief is up to his ears in it too.

Jojo
hope4natalee
seedyrum
--------------

RE: "white Suzuki on the beach"

is NOT the same as the two cars towed from Van Der Sloot's home on June 15. This is contrary to CNN's misleading story yesterday, July 5.
(see below: "new information ")

I know many of you may have resolved this but I could not find it until I searched news stories - so I appologize for the redundancy but it was very frustrating that CNN led me on a wild goose chase yesterday! So I just wanted to share what I found because several were discussing this last night.

DAVID MATTINGLY, CNN CORRESPONDENT gave incorrect information. I wish these people would double check.
=====================================

From Kalpoe's atty as stated in this transcript of

Nancy Grace for July 5, 2005, CNNHN

Aired July 5, 2005 - 20:00:00 ET

The entire transcript is at: (Scroll down to second half
@ "DAVID MATTINGLY, CNN CORRESPONDENT"

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0507/05/ng.01.html

Lisa Pinto, "But first, let`s go to CNN correspondent Dave Mattingly"

DAVID MATTINGLY, CNN CORRESPONDENT: "Well, earlier tonight, just a couple of hours ago, some
new information
coming to us in this case. Defense attorneys for the Kalpoe brothers confirmed to CNN that fishermen - - Aruban fishermen have told investigators that they did not see a couple matching the description of Natalee Holloway and Joran Van Der Sloot on the beach the night that Natalee was reported missing.

What they did see, however, was a
WHITE Suzuki on the beach.

If you remember, a WHITE Suzuki

was one of the vehicles confiscated during a search of the Van Der Sloot home.

This new information

might have been responsible in part for the judge`s decision to keep Van Der Sloot in jail for another 60 days for questioning in this case. We don`t know if it had any bearing on his decision to release the Kalpoe brothers."

============================================

My question was, "What was the car towed from VDS home?
Where can I find this info?........

I found out that IT WAS NOT A WHITE vehicle towed from VDS home...

One was RED ...
One was BLUE ...

(see below for sources and statements)
-------------------------------------------
http://www.cnn.com/2005/LAW/06/15/missing.teen/index.html

Wednesday, June 15, 2005 Posted: 7:57 PM EDT (2357 GMT)

Joran Van Der Sloot, whose home was searched Wednesday.

ORANJESTAD, Aruba (CNN) -- Authorities searched the home Wednesday of a 17-year-old detained in connection with the disappearance of an Alabama teenager more than two weeks ago. Trapenberg said he did not know what prompted the search. "People have gone over the area [before] but not as intensely as this time," he said.
=============================================


http://channels.attbusiness.net/index.cfm?fuseAction=viewNewsArticle&nav_id=33&category_name=International&article_id=96dae3ccbe53c43da08aa4d32567e67e

Investigators led a massive and fruitless search of Malmok beach June 14.

Only the following day, 16 days after Holloway went missing, did investigators search the van der Sloot house, seizing two vehicles, computers and cameras.
=============================================

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,159730,00.html
(scroll down to: "House Searched")

...
House Searched ---

Two white-uniformed investigators from Holland walked through the Van Der Sloot family's one-story, yellow-beige home Wednesday, while others guarded the entranceway.

A BLUE sport utility vehicle and
a RED Jeep were also towed from the property, which includes an attached apartment where the young man lives...

Attorney General Karin Janssen ... went into the house with investigators Wednesday,

FBI (search) agents and officers from the Miami-Dade police department brought two bloodhounds to help search that area of tropical vegetation next to the Marriott Hotel, and firefighters pumped water from the site. They gave up their search by nightfall.

===============================================
http://www.decaturdaily.com/decaturdaily/news/050616/dutch.shtml

On Tuesday, FBI agents and officers from the Miami-Dade police department used German Shepherds to search a beachside mangrove swamp next to the Marriott Hotel after a former detainee in the case said the three young men may have lied to police about where they took Holloway. The area, known as Malmok beach, is a popular nighttime spot for lovers.

...
Towed vehicles ---

Authorities towed

a BLUE sport utility vehicle and
a RED Jeep away from the house, which is

surrounded by a low stone wall and fronted by an expanse of trees and cacti.

Posted by: AkekoaHoAlethia | July 6, 2005 03:58 PM

Sorry, AAD. I don't know anything about Jamie.

AtlJoie,
Sometimes it takes five minutes for your post to show up. If you hit post, it will give an error message but send it anyway. And even with broadband, mine takes forever to post so dial up must seem like forever.

But I see your post so think they turn up eventually. Also mine turn up out of order. Thought it was just the delay and others posting but had a couple post out of the order I sent them.

Sometimes I can click view and refresh to get things going when it totally hangs, or just close connection to site and reopen one.

Jane -
I think pvds was involved in the clean up of whatever went wrong. I don't think he would call a relative, perhaps someone in gov't., or in a 'connected' way.

I'm not sure JVDS has any idea of what occurred in the 'clean up' part of whatever occurred. I do not think they will ever find Natalee and I also don't believe they will ever find out what really happened.

But I think Skyboxx has a good scenario there.

--bartholomew

There is no pic of Joran with the DJ.
Get your story straight, it's as crooked as Joran's.

I found Jaime's tickle profile. Don't know if it helps.
Somehow, his face looks VERY familiar. I can't remember from where. It says he's from Noord, which is far away from where I live.

http://connect.tickle.com/profile/index.html?id=URCEOO2LBYGd9ed3

--bartholomew

There is no pic of Joran with the DJ.
Get your story straight, it's as crooked as Joran's.

I found Jaime's tickle profile. Don't know if it helps.
Somehow, his face looks VERY familiar. I can't remember from where. It says he's from Noord, which is far away from where I live.

http://connect.tickle.com/profile/index.html?id=URCEOO2LBYGd9ed3

eep & others

Just came across your question about the finger sign. It means '2 in the pink & 1 in the stink.' Kids tell adults it means 'What's up?' which is true - in its own peculiar way. It's a question with a built-in answer.

Altjoie-
Don't worry about the media backing off. IMO, it is what BHT is forced to ask for if she wants to get NH's remains, if in fact there are any, from the corrupt individuals who know very well what has happened. It's a tradeoff; BHT is a hero to all families, but she cannot fight organized crime at its most profound depths.

letfreedomring

I agree--
I also sent Greta - FOX the same kind of email saying they need Greta in ARUBA - not covering LONDON or something else because there are plenty in LONDON.
------------------
these posts are taking several minutes from Calif?? Then I got an error. Then when I pressed refresh it took several minutes again and when finally I got the page my post was there twice????


I am sorry my post is double - I didn't do it???


There is no pic of Joran with the DJ.
_________________________________

Johnson,

You are mistaken. Somebody posted a link to the photo yesterday. If you go into the Natallee Holloway Discussion 34 you might be able to find it.

And, how would you know such a photo DOESN'T EXIST, anyway?

I think the Aruban people are being told the media is portraying them as the "most dangerous place in the world." Maybe Disappointed and others will be glad to know this is not the truth at all. No one has said that in anything I have read or seen on TV.

Instead they say this is very unusual and shocking because of the low crime rate there. Americans do not believe everything they see in our LameStreamMedia presstitutes. That is what we are doing here, trying to glean the facts from the reporting.

Interviews tend to be most accurate for me because then I can see and hear for myself what the person said, not somebody's version of what they think was said.

But the information about Joran's party life came to the media from his own websites and postings and that of his friends who tease him about roofies and things like that.

Compare the way the two black security guards were arrested and their houses searched immediately with the arrests of Joran after ten days to cover the tracks. LE just refused to take the forensics, security tapes all along the way in this and waited until they were forced by the media and Beth to do anything at all.

It is not the media telling us to think this but watching and seeing it for ourselves. Many times the media does not evey notice nor wonder why something was not done but we do after seeing that it was not.

Where are the clothing Joran was wearing and his fingernail scrapings? That has been standard in every civilized country for twenty years. And he was seen in the shirt later so it was not tken before he ws given ten days to wash away and traces.

We do not want to twist anything and if there are instances and specifics that you can help us with, please do. Crime happens everywhere and we really do want to know what happened. So if you know of errors in World Journier's time line, please contact him to correct them. Like you, we want tthe truth, too, and do not blame the local Arubans but rather the circle of power protecting the VDS.

Disappointed: After watching today’s news about the terrorist attacks in London, I would have to say that this whole mess in Aruba has come at precisely the wrong time for the Aruban people. Note: The CIA Factbook says this about Aruba. “Tourist arrivals have declined in the aftermath of the 11 September 2001 terrorist attacks on the US. The government now must deal with a budget deficit and a negative trade balance.”

http://cia.gov/cia/publications/factbook/geos/aa.html

During times of high global threat, travelers become more risk-averse, and they need additional assurances out of Aruba that it is SAFE to travel there. That is just human nature. And they don’t need to be reminded that there are good Arubans and bad Arubans. They already know that, just as they know that there are good Muslims and bad Muslims. They need to know that Aruba has the political will to get to the bottom of the corruption, nepotism, and cronyism that has resulted in this mess.

By my calculations, Aruba stands to lose $2 billion of commercial property value, as a direct result of the mishandling of this investigation.
That is the equivalent of a class 5 hurricane, except that there is no insurance available for this type of loss.

If there is a voice of sanity on the island of Aruba, please give them these figures. At yesterday's rally, one Aruban held up a sign that read, "If you don't like our Dutch system of justice, go home." Well, in the United States, we have a saying, "Be careful what you pray for, because you might just get it."

I keep getting this error:

Proxy Error
The proxy server received an invalid response from an upstream server.
The proxy server could not handle the request POST /t/comments.

Reason: Error reading from remote server
...........................................

Does anyone else get it?

I keep getting this error
..................

Proxy Error
The proxy server received an invalid response from an upstream server.
The proxy server could not handle the request POST /t/comments.

Reason: Error reading from remote server

.....................
Is anyone else having this problem?

Anna-
What would you do with JVDS's shirt and fingernail scrapings? He is not the one who would murder NH. He simply delivered her to "dirty hand," or to the pick-up men of "dirty hand."

And why would anyone need to know who Jaime is? Do you think HE is a drug lord?

The only way and time Fox news will really cover this whole tragedy is when the Arubans decide to go to war with the corruption and money laundering. And that's serious; a lot of good people would sacrifice their life.

Disappointed: After watching today’s news about the terrorist attacks in London, I would have to say that this whole mess in Aruba has come at precisely the wrong time for the Aruban people. Note: The CIA Factbook says this about Aruba. “Tourist arrivals have declined in the aftermath of the 11 September 2001 terrorist attacks on the US. The government now must deal with a budget deficit and a negative trade balance.”

http://cia.gov/cia/publications/factbook/geos/aa.html

During times of high global threat, travelers become more risk-averse, and they need additional assurances out of Aruba that it is SAFE to travel there. That is just human nature. And they don’t need to be reminded that there are good Arubans and bad Arubans. They already know that, just as they know that there are good Muslims and bad Muslims. They need to know that Aruba has the political will to get to the bottom of the corruption, nepotism, and cronyism that has resulted in this mess.

A travel boycott of Aruba does not achieve the goal....play out that scenario in your head....play it all the way through...let's say their tourism, industry takes a hard hit from America...what does that achieve? Does is solve the gov't corruption? Money laundering? Drug transhipment? No. The only thing that happens is the rich and corrupt figure our how to get richer and more corrupt, with a little help from their freinds...and the poor...will get poorer...and there will be more and more Natalees.

PROFESSOR:

Bad choice of words ---- trying to express
"compliment" directed toward the people who
live on the island of Aruba

NH story is now officially "off the record". Media is fickle and will follow the hotspots, which are now in London and elsewhere with the terror issues and in the US with the hurricanes lining up to hit us. Unless there is true breaking news, the NH story wont be mentioned. You nightly junkies better get used to no news on this story. Its old news now. Sad but true.

The good news is that with the elevated terror alert anyone planning to travel to Aruba can get a refund!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Friendship is a two way street

Aruba is protesting the media coverage. Isnt that misdirected?

JVDS and PVDS knows what happened and why where how.

Doesnt JVDS and PVDS owe something to the Aruba for causing and bringing this unwanted ( maybe they wanted to be in the headlines and spotlight)
media attention?

Shouldnt Aruba people demand JVDS and PVDS to do the "manly" (forgive me, other responsible men for associating these two with your gender)to stop this charade and farce of an investigation and confess.

Let folks get back to their normal(some lives will be irrevetreiveably) changed after this.

JVDS and PVDS having their friends to "lie, fabricate, hide, commit, dispose, cheat, steal to cover for them.

What Aruba citizen can view the FRIENDS OF PVDS and JVDS in the same way previous to this case?

Who among you bloggers would cover for a friend in a murder and compiracy?

More importantly,

When do PVDS and JVDS stop having their friends stop risking jobs, reputation, image, and word for this investigation?

When do PVDS and JVDS become a friend to the Aruba people?


if not NOW then when?

The NH story is directly connected to terrorism.
It only goes away if we let it.

IN CASE YOUR INTERESTED, THIS IS THE RESPONSE (or lack of) I GOT FROM FOX!! Seems they deleted my message without reading it! I sent a nasty message back........

Screw Fox!

Your message

To: Show -Viewer Services
Subject: Fw: GRETA
Sent: Thu, 7 Jul 2005 15:08:04 -0400

was deleted without being read on Thu, 7 Jul 2005 17:03:27 -0400

Your message

To: Show -Viewer Services
Subject: Greta
Sent: Thu, 7 Jul 2005 16:07:41 -0400

was deleted without being read on Thu, 7 Jul 2005 16:44:17 -0400

Guess they are no longer interested in this story? Interesting they delete without reading viewer emails.

Excellent post, MS.

Moonshadow: I read the signs out in front of the courthouse, and so did every other American. Do I propose a boycott of Aruba? No. But then, nobody asked me. Each traveler will make his or her own decision. That's the way we do it, in the United States. Right now, do I believe there should be travel advisories against travel to Aruba? Hell, yes. It's not safe. But any permanent damage will be done by the Aruban authorities, who would rather wreck the Aruban economy than give up a favorite son.

To Island Hopper- Great advice i have just emailed fox.....and everyone should- loosing viewers would be the last thing they want !!!

Email I sent ----

Please keep Greta in Aruba- she is awesome … I am sure you have other reporters to follow whatever you took her away from Aruba to cover.

Greta has kept the case alive, been the voice of America, and given the the Holloway’s even more strength…. I think you will loose your viewers to other channels covering the Holloway case anyway – thanks,

Viewerservices@foxnews.com
FOXaroundtheworld@foxnews.com (non-U.S. viewers only)

Moonshadow-
You're soooo right about a boycott. The poorest would feel it the most.

ExGMan- Sad, but true

SeedyRum-Never.

JVDS and PVDS don't care about the Arubans. They're part of the problem of those connected in the ring of corruption. What a way to live, right? Despicables. For them to "get out", they'd need witness protection and a lot of plastic surgery. Anyway, IMO, JVDS is too much in love with that type of life. That's why he can smirk and smile all the time.

IHOP< Thanks for the email addy. I have emailed Fox and I have also emailed everyone in my addy book to do the same. We desperately need Greta, she is the only reason this case has gotten as far as it has.

GO AWAY DENNIS THE MENACE!

Perhaps in the subject line we need to put "London", .........then blast them for the cold shoulder they are giving Greta's and Foxx's fans? Arrogance and media at it's worst.

Maybe their e-mail server is overloaded due to the terror attacks and they are deleting as many as possible that don't seem urgent just by reading the subject line. I'm sure they read 1 or 2 that said "Greta" and figured all the rest were the same kind of request.

Fact is, she's on her way back. She usually comes home weekends anyway. Maybe she'll be back in Aruba on Monday.

Now you're thinking, D!

8.51-8.56-9.17-9.47....times today
5 30
5/30?

Selby and Rice both in London this morning

pattern of explosions look like out line of Aruba

By the grace of god only 39 people died, but this is odd as AQ would have caused much higher casualties...did anyone see how Rice started into the camera, thats outta charater for her.

I have not gotten a reply back from Fox yet. So keep flooding them with emails.

Everyone needs to email foxnews NOW

I emailed Fox and told them that can should keep Greta in Aruba. They have more than enough reporters to cover stories.

NOTE: I DO KNOW HOW TO TURN FOX NEWS OFF and will.

Viewerservices@foxnews.com
FOXaroundtheworld@foxnews.com (non-U.S. viewers only).

Professor, I agree about the travel advisories, but I'm sure there is a bunch of bureaucratic red tape and hoops that must be jumped through before the State Department issues one. That's why I suggested the letter writing campaign to as many congressional rep's we have here, to put pressure on the Stae Dept to "peel that onion" back, and reveal what's under it.

Once we get a response, our next question will be, "Why aren't there travel advisories?"

Wonder when the anger from citizens of Aruba will shift away from the Holloway's and towards the Van Der Sloots...... that will soon be- One Poor Sad Island !!

Now Foxx has me annoyed, just tried sending to their e-addy for the world wide viewers, subject line 'London' to see what they are doing with those emails. I will let you know if i get the same msg that they have deleted without viewing.

FOXaroundtheworld@foxnews.com

Unfortunately Kitty Kat, the AVP party, through Jossy Mansure and Diario, will tell the Aruban people to be angry with the current MEP party, and the MEP party will tell the Aruban people to be angry at the American Media...(they already are telling them that)

moonshadow- I Believe it.... very sad !!


Well it is very disappointing to see Greta leave Aruba...however...she was really reaching last night on her program for content....sadly there is really nothing new developing on Natalee.

I also would not be surprized to hear that the US State Department was involved in her withdraw to apease the Dutch and Aruban diplomats....with elections comming up later this year in Aruba the story is affecting local politics....and a anti-US backlash in brewing...the State Department would not want more anti-US pols in power on Aruba....in short a sell out...and Fox gets more brownie points with the Bushies.

The good news is that with the elevated terror alert anyone planning to travel to Aruba can get a refund.

Your message

To: Show -Fox Around The World
Subject: London
Sent: Thu, 7 Jul 2005 17:37:34 -0400

was read on Thu, 7 Jul 2005 17:38:17 -0400

Apparently they are reading e's from viewers sent to their FOXaroundtheworld@foxnews.com address that have London in the subject line. IF you choose to email Foxx over this, I suggest this addy and this subject line so you don't get yours 'deleted without being read'.
D
(and thanks for the thumbs up moonshadow!)

Dman,

I actually thought it was informative for BTH to be retracing her steps and telling what she did from the start.

It gives better incite into the case.

Also so many details can be forgotten initially from the shock.

One can think better when one get used to( or accept) the fact then one can plan ones attack.

Greta will continue with Beth detailing all she did.

So do listen carefully

Ihop The elevated alert is only for the railraod subways.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/8494550/

No you CAN'T get a refund for travel to Aruba just because the terror alert has been elevated. Even after 9/11, the airlines weren't OBLIGATED to provide refunds/exchanges unless the flights were cancelled (as they were in the first few days when all planes were grounded in the US). Most of the airlines allowed changes if you had plans to fly in the first 3 weeks after 9/11 (I was able to change my domestic US flight, but not get a refund). So, Island Hopper, check your facts!

About Emails being returned by Fox---

I am sure this is wishful thinking but....let's hope fox is getting so many emails to keep Greta in Aruba...maybe they have decided to send her back, we will have to watch tonight and see if they mention it !!

Great Greta!

I just sent an email to fox:

Dear FOXnews,

We watch and rely on your interviews every night.

We especially appreciate the interviews from Greta.

She seems to be the only one who can get direct on camera interviews where we can see and hear first hand what people say and mean.

Characterized reports - even on FOX - are not as reliable as first hand, on camera interviews. Inflection, demeanor, body language, etc. is at least ~50% of the real message and story. So many times I have "heard" of what someone "supposedly" had said on this or other networks, only to be disappointed, surprised, and even disgusted when I saw the actual interview and truly understood what was actually being communicated (not just spoken by words) in its entire context.

Her reporting is invaluable, especially in this case, or as we watched daily, also in the Peterson murders.

We are greatly disappointed to read that Greta is leaving ARUBA. Fox and EVERY network has multitudes of people world wide to report on the London bombings. We don't need another one there. The Natalee story is specifically her kind of expertise. You and she are the only ones on top of the Natalee H. case. Her departure will leave not only a big void in this TRUE reporting, but it will increase fears and speculations for ALL of your viewers all over the world who, like us, depend on FOX being there to get the kind of interviews that ONLY she can get.

Greta has a gentle, disarming manner, that I have noticed puts people at ease. I never saw Marianne Croes, Arlene Shipper, Beth Holloway, even Suspects and their lawyers even crack a smile until they were at ease. This brings out the real person, even with Paulus VDS! -- though it was not a smile that "cracked," it was a "dripping" look at real emotions!

Greta (and Hannity) cannot be replaced in ARUBA with this story.
I implore FOX to reconsider.

Please send Greta back! We need Hannity and Greta on this story.

well Greta will be in Washington


I believe Nationa Enquirer( although they pay for information, they having been getting it right lately)

i'm going to miss greata in aurba tonight, however she will be back. this is her story after all and it's huge. no way is she going to stay away for very long.

I Hopper:

I hope all your travel agent contacts advise their clients properly on that point....maybe the terrorists are planning to blow up the "Tatto", "Carlos & Charlies"....and some drug/rave hang outs...now that would really be a national crises for Aruba.

My email to Hannity failed:
.............................
This is an automatically generated Delivery Status Notification.

Delivery to the following recipients failed.

hannity@foxnews.com
.......................................

nancy grace stays on the domestic issues and she sure is one tough cookie. i'm emailing her to take up the slack.

Regarding FOX and sending letters

FWIW, it probably would be nice to thank Fox for the coverage they've done so far which I'm sure helped release the two innocent security guards.

We don't know if BHT has requested for the media coverage to take a break so that she can make some deal with the police chief regarding having the remains or whereaobuts of NH.

In which case, if you are requesting FOX to cover the story, you could say something like "if it is in the best interests of the H/T family" or "unless you have been requested by the family of NH, the victim, to stop coverage at this time.

Professor:

"By my calculations, Aruba stands to lose $2 billion of commercial property value, as a direct result of the mishandling of this investigation."

Your calculator, the one you bought at Wal-Mart for five bucks? The one made in China? It's out of whack. Like you.

BTW: I'll be down in Aruba next December for the Christmas holidays. I wouldn't miss it. I'll send you a postcard. What's the address of your looney bin again?

Hey with the elevated terror alert people can get their deposit back or an exchange from any reputable company on ANY planned trip to Aruba!!!!!!!!!

Folks, you are all beginning to get a bit scary here! This used to be a forum to list and discuss the latest news on the the disappearance of Natalee. Now it has become a site of about 20 people posting their latest conspiracy theories, even to the extent that "Dman" implies greta is leaving aruba b/c of the state department. It seems you are all mad b/c a terrorist attack has taken place and now your little world of Aruba conspiracy has been put on the backburner. There is no "NEW" news out of Aruba. There will not be anymore news out of Aruba until Joran goes to trial. Give it a rest and don't worry, Greta will be back to Aruba then. There is no "thousands and thousands" of you going to write to Foxnews and influence their decision about Greta's assignments. There maybe about 20 of you ... but that is about it. Pray for Natalee's family, Pray for the families today who have lost their loved ones b/c of the terrorists, and Pray for our sons and daughters who fight to keep you free... and yes that does mean free to blog... but really it is time to move on. Pax

Ebonius: can you send me a postcard too, have the picture of you face down on the beach with a dutch guy doing the T-bone on ya put on it, thank's

It would be great to see all the US hospitality interests who have assets in Aruba dump them and leave....because you have names like Holiday Inn, Marriott, etc, there it gives people a false sense of security.

Rats desert a sinking ship.

Don't get pissed at FOX. They were the only ones keeping the NH story on the front page. I think the letters couldn't hurt, despite what the other guy said earlier. The truth is the Holloway family was very fortunate that we had a slow news period for awhile there. After all, the media was starting to focus on the Bullshark attacks again, just like they were the summer of 2001, until 9/11 came along.

As for boycotting Aruba, I can tell you that I travel to the islands all of the time on business with large groups, was in Aruba from May 18-20 (i.e. right before this story broke), and if I have anything to do with it I won't be going back any time soon. The reason I won't be going back is not because a teenage girl got murdered by a Dutch punk and his punk friends, whom disposed of the body and evidence with help from dad, but because the system of justice down there is unstable and cannot be counted upon if god forbid something does happen. There does not appear to be accountability and there does appear to be corruption and ineptitude, a combination that i would rather not have to rely on if something goes wrong.

Aruba does have an increasing drug problem, by the way. Every time I have entered or left C and C's I have been solicited to purchase drugs---every time. I feel bad for the native Arubans, but not so much that I want to put myself at any kind of risk. By the way, there are all kinds of US interests on Aruba, from REITS that own hotels, to casino owners, etc, etc, that will also be hurt. The Cayman Islands beaches are nicer in my opinion anyway, and they need the help after getting whacked by Ivan last year.

By the way, on the subject of terrorism, I'm staring out my 25th story window at the Detroit River, which separates the US and Canada, and there are an awful lot of black helicopters patrolling the river/border today.

USMCMom-
Thank you, I agree. AND-I'm praying especially for the safety of BHT, for all the family and friends of NH, for the young men and women in Iraq and their superiors all the up to the Commander in Chief, for my friends across the channel who now live in terror of going to work and to the universities, and for the Aruban peoples. Peace to you also.

USMCMOM

Of course the terrorist attacks are disturbing. I have prayed about this quite a lot.

I am only saying that to get the best info RE Natalee we need Grtea in ARUBA. Otherwise we wouldn't know what was NEWS.

I watched the planes fly into the towers in NY as it happened on 9-11. Every network is covering London now and they have been covering terrorists for years - which is appropriate. We are and will be seeing plenty about this terrible thing.

However, I have personal reasons for being interested in this story re: NATALEE. I don't believe you could be correct in suggesting that I should not be.

Right on usmcmom check these losers out, they're going to watch their VCR recordings of past Greta's show and rewind and fast forward to see if they can see any clues in the background. Bobup's going to blowup is inflatable Greta doll and dip his hand into the jar of vaseline he keeps in his pocket. Keep writing to your Senators and Congressjokes you crazy freaks, keep writing and bouncing your emails to Fox you sad lot nobodies. Even the bounces make you feel special heh, look at me I am doing something and they responded. Greta Greta Greta !

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

Just saw this on Fox

Aruban PM Asks Navy to Help Find Holloway

Thursday, July 07, 2005

WASHINGTON — A Navy dive team that checked the waters off Iraq for explosives before the American invasion could be used in the search for a missing Alabama girl in Aruba (search), the country's prime minister says.

Prime Minister Nelson Oduber (search) made the request in a letter to Sen. Richard Shelby (search) in response to the Alabama Republican's suggestion that Aruba give the FBI more authority in the search for Natalee Holloway (search).

In his letter, Oduber says he was made aware of the unit — known as Naval Special Clearing Team One — by a Texas dive team that has been helping to look for Holloway.

"I would like to request you to use your influence to gain this authorization for the deployment of this unit free of charge to Aruba as soon as possible," Oduber wrote in the letter, dated July 1.

Shelby forwarded the request to the Pentagon and State departments, but a Navy spokesman, Lt. Herb Josey, said Thursday there had been no formal diplomatic request for use of the team. He also questioned how useful the unit could be, since it specializes in covert exercises such as detecting and de-mining underwater explosives.

"I don't know why this team would be better than any other team, but they obviously have experience working underwater," said Lt. Herb Josey.

In an interview from London, Shelby said he hoped Oduber's request was a genuine bid to help the investigation and not retaliation for his complaints that Aruba's search was insufficient.

"We're not going to stop," Shelby said. "We want a professional investigation of what's going on down there. We're not going to look around and ignore what looks to be not a thorough, perhaps even a shoddy investigation."

Holloway disappeared May 30 in Aruba while celebrating her graduation from high school in Mountain Brook, Ala. Although three young men have been connected with her disappearance, none has been charged.

In Shelby's original letter last week asking for more FBI involvement, he called the Aruban investigation a "dead end."

I never ceased to be amazed at human kind. Throw out the baby with the bathwater. Ban Fox. That is what it amounts to. If Fox had not followed this story and put it on the radar, you can bet your bottom dollar,
CNN would never have touched it and neither would MSNBC, but when they saw their ratings falling to Greta, they popped in to get a piece of the pie.

Greta is not about international affairs, politics. (Well, her husband is, but...and she is a Scientologist, so....) but the point I make here, is Greta will continue to do the story of Natalee, as this has for the first time in the history of anything she has ever done, put her ratings through the ceiling. Ban Fox if you wish, but you will not see anyone else, except maybe Dan Abrams who had to do stories of Natalee to keep up with the competition, doing any stories on this.

Thank Fox for their coverage and ask them to not let up. Can you see the forest for the trees, or is it vice versa?

Bartholomew - The picture that you are speaking of is not the DJ. It is someone who resembles him greatly, but the nose and eyebrows are different and the chin in more pointed. Some Aruban posted giving the man's identity, but I don't remember what it was. Given that so many on the island are related, perhaps it was a relative, thereby explaining the striking resemblance. I

can anyone get a translation of this? i tried the Papiamentu online translator but can't understand it. this is the article in diario about the bone that was found on monday...

thanks.

ORANJESTAD (AAN): Dialuna cu a pasa, e boto nobo di Kustwacht a sali cu divers di FBI pa e lama bruto cu tin panort di nos isla. Esaki pa motibo cu a drenta informacion cu e curpa di Natalee lo a ser benta den un canaster den e vecindaro aki.

Berdad na yegada e divernan di FBI a baha cu nan tanki unda nan a busca basta rato.

Mirando cu net e momento ey a laga e dos rumannan Kalpoe liber a haci cu hopi hende no a stress pa busca pa sa kico mas tabata pasando.

Despues di un buskeda a resulta cu e personal di FBI a bin ariba cu un weso cu ta parce un weso di lomba di un hende. Mesora a sigui cu un buskeda pa mira si tin mas, pero envano.

No ta conoci cu exactitud si e weso aki ta di hende, pero e testnan cu lo ser haci pa FBI lo demostra esaki.

Keto bay e buskeda ta sigui unda diadomingo tambe tabata tin un buskeda den awa cu boto chikito di kustwacht.

Tjonge jonge wat een LOL. Robert wat doe je hier in godsnaam man?!

RE: "white Suzuki on the beach"

is NOT the same as the two cars towed from Van Der Sloot's home on June 15. This is contrary to CNN's misleading story yesterday, July 5.
(see below: "new information ")

posted by AkekoaltoAlethia July 7, 2005 4:32pm

The 'white Suzuki' the fishermen saw could be another 'red herring', or could be a valuable piece. Having traveled to the islands and the Yucatan I can say that Suzukis' are readily avalible for car rental. The beach crowd loves them, so they are common.

Your E-mails may be coming back from Fox because their server is overloaded. I have had this happen before when I have sent messages to Brit, but eventually I got messages to him and I got a response.

Brit knows that the Natalee coverage has brought viewers by 'the droves' to Greta, and he is all about keeping Greta's ratings up as is Roger Ailes. For some reason, Brit and Roger have always wanted Greta to succeed more than any other program on TV. Ailes has a very keen eye for ratings! Send E-mails but don't be disappointed if their server is overloaded. Just keep trying, or give up so the story will go away.

To Robert Maxwell (the insensitive Jerk)

don't criticize people for posting thier opinions .. this is America, and we should all cherish the opportunity to voice our opinion--HELLO !!!

also for your information it is a FACT that every letter a congressman recieves is considered the opinion of ten - YES 10 people so don't write...but bitch !!

How many white Suzukis can there be on Aruba...I hope the Polis actually pursue that lead....and check them and there owners all out...i.e. did any of their bank accounts increase by $10K the next day?

Tideroller,

Well, maybe the DJ has a twin. I thought you were going back come back with it was a PhotoShop job.

So what is your theory about why the DJ decided to lie to help three strangers get out of a crime?

Island Hopper, MrsJimiHendrix, Proudredneck, Anna, ! and Edward THANK YOU for the words of encouragement. Much appreciated.

I agree Phantom-- they are Great- all of them !!

To those who read this blog and don't like the topic, perhaps you should set your browser to ban this site.

It specifically says:
Natalee Holloway Discussion

There are plenty of other blogs for TERRORIST attacks and insulting people or any other topic, even here on RiehlWorldView or linked from the MAIN page. I think you would find one of those forums to be what you are wanting?

It's kind of like changing TV channels. Most people don't watch or read what they don't like???

Last night the equussearch team said they will be pulling up what they think is a box or square man made object today from the rough waters..has anyone heard anything on this today ??

Irony would be letting Joran go but re-arresting his Father Paulus....It just might happen in the Aruban Justice triangle....where suspects just lie and then are released... while victums are blamed for causing the crimes...ah yes happiness in Aruba AKA better living through chemistry.

Phantom:

I was hoping you were gone.

:)

Interesting posts. Am interested in more info on that bone that was found as reported in El Diairo. On this growing issue on a white Suzuki on the beach the night of NH's disappearance; It was night time so any light colored car would appear white as any dark colored car would appear grey or black. If this is true, then the gears to cover-up a murder were well under way. Joran may not have wasted anytime. I still think it's feasable that he took her back to his place and this is where she died. He has to throw investigators on the opposite direction. Maybe everything he's said thus far is the opposite; he raped her because she 'teased' him (she wanted it), she fell on the ground when asked to get out (she was already in a coma), she became hysterical on the beach(anyone would if you tired to raped them too). She ran from him (wanted to be alone).

Bullshark,

I only stayed to torment you. ;)

Phantom, I hope you will be around to help. More help is need now, more than ever. We have so much going on that any and everyone who contributes positively here, should remain and help.

There are hurricanes for us to watch.

There is a terorrist attack.

There will be other diversions, but we need to stay here and help! This story can be directly linked to a lot of other stories.

Don't ask questions about that, but just trust me on this. There are no hurricanes on Aruba, but some other posters here from Aruba were telling us to cool it because they were about to undergo a hurricane. Don't let them call your bluff. They don't have hurricanes.

Don't let them fool you about drugs and terrorism on Aruba not being connected. You see some of the posters here that indicate a negative mindset. They are alive and real here on this board as they are everywhere.

Don't go away! Phantom, please stay and play with us!

Last night the equussearch team said they will be pulling up what they think is a box or square man made object today from the rough waters..has anyone heard anything on this today ??

Posted by: kitty kat | July 7, 2005 07:10 PM

-- huh??

Can you consider this? We heard early on that the Kalpoes were involved in a car rental business.

One poster stated many people rent white Suzukis on Aruba. They are very popular.

I am not saying the Kalpoes own a car rental business, but do they have ties to someone who does that could have made a white Suzuki readily available?

Think, Guys & Girls. We need to know what Beth knows. If we concentrate, we might be able to figure out what she knows that we do not! Where did the story about Kalpoes and car rental business come from? This is becoming very interesting.

Yes Phantom, we need you right here!!!!

Jojo

Did you scroll up to the answer to your post re the white suzuki?

..............
http://www.decaturdaily.com/decaturdaily/news/050616/dutch.shtml

On Tuesday, FBI agents and officers from the Miami-Dade police department used German Shepherds to search a beachside mangrove swamp next to the Marriott Hotel after a former detainee in the case said the three young men may have lied to police about where they took Holloway. The area, known as Malmok beach, is a popular nighttime spot for lovers.

...
Towed vehicles ---

Authorities towed

a BLUE sport utility vehicle and
a RED Jeep away from the house

...........................
Posted by: AkekoaHoAlethia | July 7, 2005 04:32 PM

Loesje,

Is ut niet enig om al dees (URY) Ugly Redneck Yankees te zien janku om het vetrek van Greta van S uit Aruba?? Ik vind het gieeeeeeeeeeeren! Want jawoor er zijn tog wel andere veul belangrijkere zaken op deez aardkloot. Het leed van Londen bijv. Maar het lezu van deez totaal gefrusty yankees over ene deerne die misgien met d'r togus belletjes hapt op de bodem van de zee of tog zippend aan een Barcardi Rum op een ander stekkie in de buurt van Aruba zit, vermaakt mij al sedert dag één dat het All American Breezah-drinking-and-using-drugs-Natalee de pleiterik heeft gemaakt. Ja ikke vind het wel sapperdeflapperenig om lekker tegengas te geven aan dat idote US vee wat hier rondspookt. Een dag geen USA gebashed is een dag niet ..... ehhh geplast. Een volle blaas is ook nix tog?

Maar genoeg geouwehoer op deze Ugly Redneck Yankee blogvloer. Laat ze nu maar lekker translaten wat hier staat want ze snappu er tog geen hol van! Weetjewah ik geef wel nog ff het linkie erbij:

http://www.freetranslation.com/

En om die Yanks nog meer Pissed off te maken:

Bye, bye you southern trailertrash, go play your Banjo and dance the KKK-dance till you drop dead. And if you go to sleep I hope you bedbugs do bite you in your big southern asses.... Howdy howdy Yahoeee!!

Just sat down...trying to catch up...must contribute to the Phantom comments...

Phantom...if you leave...who will criticize my eating behavior?!

There are pictures on this site that show both of the cars that were towed from the Sloot home. A BLUE SUV and a RED JEEP.

The file is big but has some good pics including the two cars.

http://www.geocities.com/proud_college_republican/

After repeatedly watching the video of the brothers arriving back home I'm thinking that Satish isn't all there. Kinda slow. Maybe was only along for the ride.

It has been said that the Kalpoe brothers father or step father is in the auto import/export business as is this fellow Lorenzo who seems to have the air tight alibi....autos have always been used to smuggle contraban....a sedated or deceased Natalee probably was smuggled out in the trunk of a car or in some other shipping container...that is why Joran is smirking so much...he knows there is no physical evidence of her on the Island anywhere....and so does his father.

To JoJo-

last night the founder of equussearch was interviewed, he showed the sonar scan from very dangerous waters, (the divers can not even stay down to long-the currents are so bad- )they have an object they believe is a square box they were trying to pull up today-- any news ??

Does anyone else think it is odd that one of the first posters put up in aruba by BHT was this. It seems she thought NH ran away.

phttp://www.geocities.com/dutch_on_aruba/nhposteraruba

boy, that dutch post was real intelligent, eh.

News from the Caribbean as of Thursday July 7, 2005


Aruban libel threat in missing girl case
Thursday, July 7, 2005
ORANJESTAD, Aruba (UPI): The mother of a missing Alabama teenager could face a libel lawsuit for speaking publicly about two suspects' release from an Aruban jail.

Wednesday, after police released brothers Satish and Deepak Kalpoe, 18 and 21, based on lack of evidence, Beth Holloway Twitty made a statement to reporters denouncing the move.

Her 18-year-old daughter, Natalee Holloway, has been missing since May 30, and was last seen with the brothers and Joran Van Der Sloot, 17.

But the Kalpoe brothers' attorney, Elgin Zeppenfeldt, threatened legal action for the mother's remarks, CNN said.

He accused her of making "prejudicial, inflammatory, libelous and totally outrageous" statements.

"She called our client, Mr. Satish Kalpoe, a 'criminal ... involved in a violent crime against my daughter' and who is 'allowed to walk freely among the tourists and citizens,'" Zeppenfeldt said in a statement.

Late Wednesday, a lawyer for the Holloway family said the comments reflected "a mother's desperation after weeks of trying to find her daughter. When emotion kicks in, reason kicks out."

An apology was not ruled out, the report said.

END

OK, HOW ABOUT Satish and Deepak Kalpoe APOLOGIZE TO BETH ABOUT THEIR COMMENTS ABOUT NATALEE?
WHERE'S THE PROFF?

kitty kat,

Please understand that there is a major hurricane just a couple of hundred miles to the north of Aruba. The seas on the north side of Aruba are probably too rough to dive safely. Might be a couple of days yet before they can dive.

Dutchlosers fyi

I would never post an intelligent post for people as stupid as you are...

A civil lawsuit would be great. Then BTH's attorney could depose the Kalpoe boys. :)
They would have to prove what she said was false...

Chica,

I won't criticize yours if you don't criticize mine.

Deal? ;)

Had BBQ babyback spareribs for dinner.

Ah yes... another dimension of the Aruban Justice Triangle is where the rapist's father gives the victum $10k to run away hide from everyone and take drugs until they have no recollection of any crimes committed on their persons.

Aruan attorney on Greta's show last night said that in a CIVIL suit in Aruba, the parties to the suit do not have to submit to depositions, only witnesses.

Yes that is right. They (family) owns America Car rental in Aruba.

Moonshadow,

From what I understand is that if the Kelpoes file a civil suit against BHT they don't have to be deposed under oath.

ANOTHER outstanding law under the Dutch government.

ANOTHER outstanding law under the Dutch government.

LOL I swear I thnk they write the laws as the situation arises and seem to have quite a bit of flexibility in the interrputation of these laws~

What a screwy system.

Since I'm playing catch-up...wanted to let you know that a new forum is open!

You can say that again.

Thanks Phantom- no wonder everyone likes you !! hope they got to did alittle diving today and they have also asked for more advanced equiptment from the navy-- so hopefully that will all come together soon-!!

Thank you Chica.

Well if the Kalpoe brothers sue BHT they can be almost assured of never being allowed in anyother country and they will be sentenced to life in the Aruban Justise Triangle where the perps go free and the victums are punished.

Informant, are you sure the family of the Kalpoe brothers owns a car rental business by that name? If so, that would make a white Suzki easy to get in the middle of the night.

Satish could have driven one car and Deepak the other, which would have been why the "very honest" Joran could not remember who was driving when he said, "I called Satish," "no, Deepak was driving." There was more than one car involved. One was obtained from the car rental, the white Suzuki.

how does lorenzo fit in here ??

Question for anyone:

Between 1:00 PM and 2:00 PM PST today, I logged onto this site. There was a short posting from Dan stating that BHT was at the search site today crying. I had to suddently log off and 15 - 20 minutes later I logged back on and that post had disappeared. Am I crazy or did anyone else see that post?

Bartholomew - My theory is that he was ordered to lie to get the 3 thugs off. Or possibly blackmailed into doing it by PVDS who still had some pull in the judicial system at that time. (Well, still does have influence obviously, he got off!)

didn't she have dinner with him earlier that night ??

Yes I'm shure. It was under another name a few years back when they got in trouble with the law back then. That's when they chenged the name to American Car Rental.
Now I'm talking about some other (but close)family members not them.

PR:

You might be on to something there and it is a perfectly logical outcome in the Aruban Justice Triangle where the Polis only seize those cars in which no evidence will ever be found.

didn't she have dinner with him earlier that night ??

Posted by: kitty kat | July 7, 2005 07:50 PM

NO!

sorry- that's what i had heard- on the blog- not the news alot of screwed up stories on him- pvds illigimate son, then not, owns a white vehicle, drug dealer etc.--

i know alot of lies are on the blog.. but alot is factual !! thanks !!

Informant

Here is the SUZUKI website with photos:

http://www.suzukiauto.com/sr_04/full_line.php
http://www.suzukiauto.com/sr_05/full_line.php

The "beach siting" said White Suzuki SUV in one report I heard.

Which one was seen on the beach?
Which ones are rented out?

informant --

is there a web site or link for that:

American Car Rental

..............
How about a link for the ARUBAN Dept of motor vehicles?

How about a link for the ARUBAN Dept of motor vehicles?

Posted by: AkekoaHoAlethia | July 7, 2005 08:05 PM

Knowing DMVs it might you ALL day to access that site.

Informant

I think I found it:

Is this it?

http://www.american-car-rental.com/english_about_us.html

American Jeep & Car rental was founded on February 21st 1994 and had it's first day of operation on December 1st the same year. AJCR was formerly established at the Kamerlingh Onnestraat 72 in Oranjestad, the capital of Aruba. AJRC is a family owned business with Mr. Raj Misier sole ownership. Together with his wife (Bea Misier) and son (Akash Misier). The business started with 18 cars. Very soon AJCR realized the necessity which also happened and in four years of operation AJCR had over 100 cars.
AJCR prides itself in service, quality and safety when maintenance is also integral part of our business. AJCR cars are always clean and well maintained. We offer the best quality cars against the lowest rates. We are simply the best, and better than all the rest. We might not have an internationally registered name but we are sure to surprise you once you give us a try.

Kamerlingh Onnestraat # 72 | Aruba, Dutch Caribbean
Phone: (297) 5880299 - 5839742 - 5880612 | Fax: (297) 5839752
info@american-car-rental.com

Didn't who have dinner with whom?? Trying to catch up.

Lovemycarin, where did you get that photo of that reward poster? First time I have seen it but there is something badly wrong with it. May I ask where you found or saw it? Could not have come from the mother and I wonder who posted it. Has a key word spelled wrong so is fake but am curious as to who would make such a thing.

Car rental. Lots of cars there and lots of trunks, too. Well, what kind of car was it that PVDS ran to like a nutcase when leaving police station and the media was trying to photograph him? Was that a white susuki? There is something totally off about that car, seems to not have a passenger seat for some reason.

I see American Car Rental has a SUZUKI XL7 SUV

http://www.american-car-rental.com/english_low.html

http://www.suzukiauto.com/sr_05/xl7/

Can some one ask the fishermen if this is what they saw that night on the beach where JVDS said he was?

luvmycairn: Many have thought the initial poster was odd. Many think it is fake. Others don't think so.

BHT has referenced how many days it has been since she has seen her daughter and it adds up to being May 30th.

She is enduring a nightmare situation and I am not picking on her for stating it had been 36 days since she saw her daughter (instead of 41).

Aruban officials could seize on ANY spoken error by an exhausted BHT and Joran could walk and that would not be justice.

Hey

Trying to catch up!!!!

OFF TOPIC:

Watchingclosely

I read your earlier post and I was wondering which side of the Detroit River you are on Can. or US??

Born and raised in Windsor myself.

Anna

"what kind of car was it that PVDS ran to like a nutcase when leaving police station and the media was trying to photograph him? Was that a white susuki?"

No

The night PVDS ran from reporters he was using, and still is, a silver sedan that is NOT a Suzuki.

I think it is a small mercedes. I heard a reporter say that. It is pictured on the geocities site linked above:

http://www.geocities.com/proud_college_republican/

sapper,
We ugly American redneck bloggers do not take kindly to your posting derogatory remarks about this girl who is likely deceased and is not here to defend herself.
Cowardly. Big talk when she cannot hear you, typical however. Sad and pathetic.
Nice of you to type the nasty things in English for us so no one will miss your insults of the victim including her friends and family who read and post here. But remember this is a blog FOR Natalee so why don't you go to the one for people who condone this sort of thing being done to the tourist and leave us alone?

Forum 36 is up now.

Hi Anna-- about your question---Didn't who have dinner with whom?? Trying to catch up.

lorenzo van rijn- somehow linked to the vander sloots-i read he was out to dinner with natalee...but joran will not give up that info. and a few stories about who he is-- maybe phantom can sum it up for us ---The phantom knows alot !!

Yep, that's it.
I'm done here.

Any new events?

Events in London will take the front page. I hope that Natalee will not be lost in the rush to cover the news.

No Moonshadow,

you are wrong

Dman,

it is said that Natalee's father or is it the stepfather that is in the insurance bussiness.

hmm I wonder...................

WHERE is Joran's well-dressed Bogota, Colombia, buddy Jaime?

I would very much appreciate a verifiable answer from someone who knows.

Thank you.

Posted by: Able Advocate DAN | July 7, 2005 03:10 PM
=======================================

WELL-DRESSED?

Sapper,

Moet je niet naar school ? Ik vindt het erg zielig dat je je hier so frusty moet uitlaten. Volgens mij heb je geen sociaal leven! Ben je somes een pukkelige tiener zonder frienden ?

Good news

No1... The FBI do have part of the duct tape / hair evidence

No2 It`s only going to take a week.

Een wandelaar vond het stuk plakband afgelopen zaterdag op een Arubaans strand en heeft vervolgens de politie gebeld, zei Jan van der Straten, leider van het politieonderzoek. "De haren zijn naar de FBI en naar het gerechtelijk laboratorium in Nederland gestuurd voor nader onderzoek. We verwachten aan het eind van deze week resultaat", zei Van der Straten.

Van der sloot, the father, needs to be locked up. Wonder way he isn't. The actions of the gov speak louder than words